[tinku]

Damien Hirst recently had a big exhibition in Mexico City, at the Jumex Museum. During the last weekend, he gave away these signed spin paintings (edition of 500) to those who answered a trivia about his pieces correctly. We were lucky to grab a couple as a family and I am therefore considering selling one of these in order to fund my own artistic projects.

I have no clue about the pricing on these, although I have some references about similar pieces (unsigned Kiev edition, etc.). Please feel free to comment here with your advice (even if not interested in the piece) or DM your offer.

Note: The pieces are signed by Hirst, blind stamped and numbered on the back. They measure 52 cm x 48.3 cm approx. and are made on cardboard.

[Londown 01]

I am having a deja vu, at least for the second time

[tinku]

Oct 14, 2024 20:51:57 GMT 1 Londown 01 said:

I am having a deja vu, at least for the second time

Care to elaborate?

[kjg]

I think that Londown01 refers to this thread in which there is already a lot of talk about these prints: urbanartassociation.com/thread/190014/free-painting-damien-hirst-mexico

[tinku]

Oct 14, 2024 21:29:15 GMT 1 kjg said:

I think that Londown01 refers to this thread in which there is already a lot of talk about these prints: urbanartassociation.com/thread/190014/free-painting-damien-hirst-mexico

Oh, I think they are not redundant, but feel free to tell me if you see it that way.

[tinku]

Any help to give these a fair valuation from a third party would be greatly appreciated.

[Londown 01]

Don't know if these compare but a butterfly that reminded me of yours is coming up for auction in this auction house. Might be of help

www.dorotheum.com/en/l/9241063/

[tinku]

Nov 1, 2024 20:16:52 GMT 1 Londown 01 said:

Don't know if these compare but a butterfly that reminded me of yours is coming up for auction in this auction house. Might be of help

www.dorotheum.com/en/l/9241063/

Thanks a lot, Londown!

I believe that butterfly is part of the series (skull, house, butterfly...) made by the public in Kiev, in 2009. They are not signed (only stamped by Hirst's studio) nor numbered, as they were being produced there and were virtually unlimited. This eagle was released by Hirst (we all know he probably didn't touch most of his production before signing it) for this show and was part of an edition of 500. Each piece is numbered and signed on the front, as well as being blind-stamped, etc. However, I will keep an eye on the results.

I saw some pieces with similar characteristics (although dedicated on the front or not numbered, etc., which reduce their value) being sold for around 9K - 20K on auctions in recent years. I know this is not the best time for the art market (and probably for Hirst's in particular), but his prices have gone up and down in time and that is part of his reputation as the "bad guy" of contemporary art. Do you think that asking for around 6.5/7K would be unfair for any of the parties, considering that I won't be paying a premium?

I want the price to be fair and I would prefer to sell it here, even if that means selling it cheaper, but I also don't want to give it away for free (have received some reasonable offers, but also some very low ones, closer to the value of Hirst's signed posters), as I am parting ways with this in order to fund some very expensive artistic processes of my own.

[compound]

Nov 2, 2024 18:52:45 GMT 1 tinku said:

Nov 1, 2024 20:16:52 GMT 1 Londown 01 said:

Don't know if these compare but a butterfly that reminded me of yours is coming up for auction in this auction house. Might be of help

www.dorotheum.com/en/l/9241063/

Thanks a lot, Londown!

I believe that butterfly is part of the series (skull, house, butterfly...) made by the public in Kiev, in 2009. They are not signed (only stamped by Hirst's studio) nor numbered, as they were being produced there and were virtually unlimited. This eagle was released by Hirst (we all know he probably didn't touch most of his production before signing it) for this show and was part of an edition of 500. Each piece is numbered and signed on the front, as well as being blind-stamped, etc. However, I will keep an eye on the results.

I saw some pieces with similar characteristics (although dedicated on the front or not numbered, etc., which reduce their value) being sold for around 9K - 20K on auctions in recent years. I know this is not the best time for the art market (and probably for Hirst's in particular), but his prices have gone up and down in time and that is part of his reputation as the "bad guy" of contemporary art. Do you think that asking for around 6.5/7K would be unfair for any of the parties, considering that I won't be paying a premium?

I want the price to be fair and I would prefer to sell it here, even if that means selling it cheaper, but I also don't want to give it away for free (have received some reasonable offers, but also some very low ones, closer to the value of Hirst's signed posters), as I am parting ways with this in order to fund some very expensive artistic processes of my own.

My guess is you won’t achieve £6.5k for one of these. 

[Londown 01]

Nov 2, 2024 18:52:45 GMT 1 tinku said:

Nov 1, 2024 20:16:52 GMT 1 Londown 01 said:

Do you think

I literally don't have an opinion, don't comment on pricing very often. Just came across the lot and thought I'd share. 

Something that looks similar (don't know if the details all match) was just sold at Tate Ward: 


www.tateward.com/auction/lot/lot-152---damien-hirst-british-1965--butterfly-spin-2004/?lot=22096&so=0&st=hirst&sto=0&au=111&ef=&et=&ic=False&sd=1&pp=96&pn=1&g=1

[tinku]

Nov 2, 2024 19:06:52 GMT 1 Londown 01 said:

Nov 2, 2024 18:52:45 GMT 1 tinku said:

Do you think

I literally don't have an opinion, don't comment on pricing very often. Just came across the lot and thought I'd share. 

Something that looks similar (don't know if the details all match) was just sold at Tate Ward: 


www.tateward.com/auction/lot/lot-152---damien-hirst-british-1965--butterfly-spin-2004/?lot=22096&so=0&st=hirst&sto=0&au=111&ef=&et=&ic=False&sd=1&pp=96&pn=1&g=1

Thanks! This is indeed closer. Although not numbered, it is also signed on the front and part of the same big series of custom-shaped spin paintings.

It is amazing how the prices have gone down. A very similar one (which was dedicated on the front, severely reducing its price) was sold for 25,000 GBP in 2019!

www.sothebys.com/en/buy/auction/2019/contemporary-art-online-2/damien-hirst-untitled-paper-spin-butterfly-gift

[tinku]

Nov 2, 2024 19:00:31 GMT 1 compound said:

Nov 2, 2024 18:52:45 GMT 1 tinku said:

Thanks a lot, Londown!

I believe that butterfly is part of the series (skull, house, butterfly...) made by the public in Kiev, in 2009. They are not signed (only stamped by Hirst's studio) nor numbered, as they were being produced there and were virtually unlimited. This eagle was released by Hirst (we all know he probably didn't touch most of his production before signing it) for this show and was part of an edition of 500. Each piece is numbered and signed on the front, as well as being blind-stamped, etc. However, I will keep an eye on the results.

I saw some pieces with similar characteristics (although dedicated on the front or not numbered, etc., which reduce their value) being sold for around 9K - 20K on auctions in recent years. I know this is not the best time for the art market (and probably for Hirst's in particular), but his prices have gone up and down in time and that is part of his reputation as the "bad guy" of contemporary art. Do you think that asking for around 6.5/7K would be unfair for any of the parties, considering that I won't be paying a premium?

I want the price to be fair and I would prefer to sell it here, even if that means selling it cheaper, but I also don't want to give it away for free (have received some reasonable offers, but also some very low ones, closer to the value of Hirst's signed posters), as I am parting ways with this in order to fund some very expensive artistic processes of my own.

My guess is you won’t achieve £6.5k for one of these. 

Thanks, compound. I was talking in USD (so around £5k), but yes, if the market is that low I think it might be better to keep it for now.

[Wendero]

Nov 2, 2024 19:11:18 GMT 1 tinku said:

Nov 2, 2024 19:06:52 GMT 1 Londown 01 said:

I literally don't have an opinion, don't comment on pricing very often. Just came across the lot and thought I'd share. 

Something that looks similar (don't know if the details all match) was just sold at Tate Ward: 


www.tateward.com/auction/lot/lot-152---damien-hirst-british-1965--butterfly-spin-2004/?lot=22096&so=0&st=hirst&sto=0&au=111&ef=&et=&ic=False&sd=1&pp=96&pn=1&g=1

Thanks! This is indeed closer. Although not numbered, it is also signed on the front and part of the same big series of custom-shaped spin paintings.

It is amazing how the prices have gone down. A very similar one (which was dedicated on the front, severely reducing its price) was sold for 25,000 GBP in 2019!

www.sothebys.com/en/buy/auction/2019/contemporary-art-online-2/damien-hirst-untitled-paper-spin-butterfly-gift

Well, if you sell this one at £5k you’re not lucky, you’ll be very lucky…

[tinku]

Nov 2, 2024 19:14:48 GMT 1 Wendero said:

Nov 2, 2024 19:11:18 GMT 1 tinku said:

Thanks! This is indeed closer. Although not numbered, it is also signed on the front and part of the same big series of custom-shaped spin paintings.

It is amazing how the prices have gone down. A very similar one (which was dedicated on the front, severely reducing its price) was sold for 25,000 GBP in 2019!

www.sothebys.com/en/buy/auction/2019/contemporary-art-online-2/damien-hirst-untitled-paper-spin-butterfly-gift

Well, if you sell this one at £5k you’re not lucky, you’ll be very lucky…

Based on...?

[Acme Thunderer]

Just to bring this thread back to some kind of reality…

- It’s a nice novelty item.

- The piece is a freebie given away at an exhibition so the value will be reflective of this as it had no value beforehand.

- Damien Hirst signed items are not rare (as it is harder to find something unsigned).

- It is not a commercially released work so you will not get someone specifically wanting it.

- As the image is specific to Mexico, then the demand from outside Mexico will be limited.

- Snakes are not wall-friendly (especially if they look like they will shortly be eaten).

- We have not seen anyone else try to sell one from the exhibition and if it was going to be an in-demand item during the exhibition, the flippers would have been all over it.

- As you managed to get two, this will give you an idea of how many people wanted them.

- The amount of discussion has been virtually non-existent (on here and on other art grounds/forums), so this will give you an idea of demand.

- If there was any demand, you would have been inundated with PM’s from people wanting to buy.

- Round spin paintings (that are much nicer and wall friendly) can be bought for circa £5k.

My advice is not to base any valuations by Googling other Damien Hirst sales. It is like having a cough and trying to get a diagnosis from Google and then thinking you have one week left to live (i.e. it is not unreliable).

I am not low-balling, but you will only get something in the region of £500-£1,000. The best thing to do is see if a gallery will take it (not auction), who will then rip off some unsuspecting rich idiot.

GLWTS

[tinku]

Thank you for your feedback, Acme Thunderer . It is very unbiased and it does give me all the negative aspects I should consider to have in mind.

I have gotten a couple of offers in the 3K-4K USD range. But Wendero offered less than 3 USD as well, so the pricing is indeed very subjective.

And yes, I am sure many spin paintings can be bought for 5 USD (edit: as you stated in your original post). I don't know if many of those were done or signed by Hirst. The same can be said for most other artists that are sold in here. I wish the art market worked as you think it does. It would be wonderful for me.

About the image being friendly or not on a wall, I'm surprised at how many of you find a Vietnamese girl being burnt with napalm to be wall-friendly (it worries me), if that is what guides your collections.

[keyser]

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

Just to bring this thread back to some kind of reality…

- It’s a nice novelty item.

- The piece is a freebie given away at an exhibition so the value will be reflective of this as it had no value beforehand.

- Damien Hirst signed items are not rare (as it is harder to find something unsigned).

- It is not a commercially released work so you will not get someone specifically wanting it.

- As the image is specific to Mexico, then the demand from outside Mexico will be limited.

- Snakes are not wall-friendly (especially if they look like they will shortly be eaten).

- We have not seen anyone else try to sell one from the exhibition and if it was going to be an in-demand item during the exhibition, the flippers would have been all over it.

- As you managed to get two, this will give you an idea of how many people wanted them.

- The amount of discussion has been virtually non-existent (on here and on other art grounds/forums), so this will give you an idea of demand.

- If there was any demand, you would have been inundated with PM’s from people wanting to buy.

- Round spin paintings (that are much nicer and wall friendly) can be bought for circa £5k.

My advice is not to base any valuations by Googling other Damien Hirst sales. It is like having a cough and trying to get a diagnosis from Google and then thinking you have one week left to live (i.e. it is not unreliable).

I am not low-balling, but you will only get something in the region of £500-£1,000. The best thing to do is see if a gallery will take it (not auction), who will then rip off some unsuspecting rich idiot.

GLWTS

Imagine having no idea what you’re talking about but still spending enough time to write this nonsense. 

[Say Hello To My Lil Friend]

Yet you reply with a nothing statement. Feel free to spread your wisdom. 

[tinku]

If Hirst is reading this, he is having a laugh. That we can all agree on. I think there is where his genius lies.

[Acme Thunderer]

Nov 2, 2024 22:19:53 GMT 1 keyser said:

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

Just to bring this thread back to some kind of reality…

- It’s a nice novelty item.

- The piece is a freebie given away at an exhibition so the value will be reflective of this as it had no value beforehand.

- Damien Hirst signed items are not rare (as it is harder to find something unsigned).

- It is not a commercially released work so you will not get someone specifically wanting it.

- As the image is specific to Mexico, then the demand from outside Mexico will be limited.

- Snakes are not wall-friendly (especially if they look like they will shortly be eaten).

- We have not seen anyone else try to sell one from the exhibition and if it was going to be an in-demand item during the exhibition, the flippers would have been all over it.

- As you managed to get two, this will give you an idea of how many people wanted them.

- The amount of discussion has been virtually non-existent (on here and on other art grounds/forums), so this will give you an idea of demand.

- If there was any demand, you would have been inundated with PM’s from people wanting to buy.

- Round spin paintings (that are much nicer and wall friendly) can be bought for circa £5k.

My advice is not to base any valuations by Googling other Damien Hirst sales. It is like having a cough and trying to get a diagnosis from Google and then thinking you have one week left to live (i.e. it is not unreliable).

I am not low-balling, but you will only get something in the region of £500-£1,000. The best thing to do is see if a gallery will take it (not auction), who will then rip off some unsuspecting rich idiot.

GLWTS

Imagine having no idea what you’re talking about but still spending enough time to write this nonsense. 

Thanks for your insightful thoughts about this item 🤔. If you have a differing opinion then we would like to hear them.

Maybe you think that something that was given away free and represents Mexico that no one previously discussed is worth thousands just because it has a signature. If you do, then please share your theory so we can have a good laugh.

[Londown 01]

Nov 3, 2024 20:10:18 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

Nov 2, 2024 22:19:53 GMT 1 keyser said:

Imagine having no idea what you’re talking about but still spending enough time to write this nonsense. 

is worth thousands just because it has a signature

I don't agree with the criticism of your post, but: the signature is exactly why Damien Hirst items (so called "prints") are worth thousands ... and it is the ONLY reason 

[tinku]

I promised myself not to answer in a detailed way to Acme Thunderer because of two main reasons:
- I didn't want to play the used car salesman's role
- I didn't think he really believed most of the things he wrote, as almost all of them were easily rebatable

However, as this has become everything but a sales post and as he continues to ask for explanations, I will spend some time doing so.

Before getting into that, I want to thank Londown 01 . He clearly believes the asking price is high and, however, he is smart and honest enough to look for valid arguments to make his point (which include, as any intelligent criticism, contradictions like those auction results for similar items that, in a low market, hit results that are significantly higher than those suggested by others).

Now, let's get into it:

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

Just to bring this thread back to some kind of reality…

- It’s a nice novelty item.

I can agree with this. The piece is quite new and it is not the best time to sell it. I am well aware of this, and I know that I would be getting more if I keep it for longer.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- The piece is a freebie given away at an exhibition so the value will be reflective of this as it had no value beforehand.

This answer has two parts:
- First of all, when I think about freebies, what comes to my mind are those items you normally sell: napkins, leaflets, etc. that are handed out at exhibitions, that are printed in the thousands and that become memoralia as time passes. Perhaps it is just my poor English (it is my third language). These were indeed given out for free, to people who answered a trivia properly. I don't think that makes them "freebies", as I feel this term is slightly derogatory. They are art pieces, just as the analogous pieces that were originally sold, either we like them or not (I personally don't like spin paintings that much, so we probably coincide in that judgement).
- Leaving aside my self-taught artist side, and talking as an economist, I think you are confusing price with value. These items didn't have a price beforehand. However, they did have value.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- Damien Hirst signed items are not rare (as it is harder to find something unsigned).

I guess unsigned pieces are selling well, then. Many collectors love rare items.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- It is not a commercially released work so you will not get someone specifically wanting it.

People can "specifically want" things that are not commercially released. In fact, most of the things I "specifically want" in my life aren't commercially released. What kind of argument is this?

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- As the image is specific to Mexico, then the demand from outside Mexico will be limited.

I will also answer to this in three parts:
- We could argue Mexico is probably (and is increasingly becoming) a cultural capital of the world (one of them, obviously not the main one). This makes Mexican culture universal (or planetary, to be more fair with the intelligent life that might exist elsewhere).
- We could also argue that all culture is universal, which would make the above point unnecessary. Plenty of artworks that depict realities that are not those we live in can still be valid in our places. Do you need me to list some examples or you can think about some by yourself?
- Even if both previous points are not true, I think any serious Hirst collector or critique would know about the influence that Mexico has on his works. He has a studio in Mexico City and some pieces like "For the love of God" (one of his most important ones) are inspired by Mexican culture (in that case, by Mexica skull inserts). Such is the Jacarandas series. He has said himself that he feels more comfortable in Mexico than in the UK, because of the role death plays in Mexican culture. Mexican motifs are then also Hirst's motifs, and therefore reflect something about his work and not just something about the country.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- Snakes are not wall-friendly (especially if they look like they will shortly be eaten).

I guess this is pretty subjective and I guess some people can like the image. I probably wouldn't hang some of the stuff you have in your collection and you probably wouldn't hang some of the stuff I have in mine. However, as I said, I don't find a Vietnamese girl being burnt with napalm to be wall-friendly, and in this specific case I do find it distressing to think about some people "liking" this image. However, I do understand the importance of the piece Banksy did, what he meant with it and therefore why some people have it hanged in their living rooms.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- We have not seen anyone else try to sell one from the exhibition and if it was going to be an in-demand item during the exhibition, the flippers would have been all over it.

I guess this is also cultural. In Mexico Hirst is not as well known as in the Anglo-Saxon world, and neither is flipping such a common practice. These pieces couldn't be bought online; you had to be at the museum to get them. They were also given out with a very short notice: one day, the Jumex Museum announced that the first 500 to answer a trivia correctly were going to take one home on the next day (most people were surprised to be asked questions when they left the exhibition, as this was not widely communicated). I believe most of these spin paintings went to curious families who visited the museum early on that day and who managed to get the trivia right, but who probably weren't familiar with Hirst's market value, to be sincere.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- As you managed to get two, this will give you an idea of how many people wanted them.

We were three, actually, and we managed to get the trivia right on our way out. We visited the Museum 10 minutes after it opened on the day the contest took place. If you have no idea about the way these were handed out, why do you jump to conclusions so easily?

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- The amount of discussion has been virtually non-existent (on here and on other art grounds/forums), so this will give you an idea of demand.

You are right about this. Hirst didn't post these pieces on his social media and, as I told you, the museum didn't make a big deal about the contest, so I believe that most people aren't even aware of their existence. I wouldn't take this forum as a reference, though. It has been quite empty lately and, judging by some comments, I start to understand why. I miss the good old days.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- If there was any demand, you would have been inundated with PM’s from people wanting to buy.

Last time I spoke with Snowden you still didn't have access to my inbox. Again, talking about things you don't know.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- Round spin paintings (that are much nicer and wall friendly) can be bought for circa £5k.

Again, this judgement is subjective. They are, objectively, also much more common (they were produced in the thousands). I do believe that some Hirst collectors would value rarity over your own aesthetic judgement.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

My advice is not to base any valuations by Googling other Damien Hirst sales. It is like having a cough and trying to get a diagnosis from Google and then thinking you have one week left to live (i.e. it is not unreliable).

I often feel bad for people who underestimate other's intelligence. It often says more about themselves than about the people they are talking to.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

I am not low-balling, but you will only get something in the region of £500-£1,000. The best thing to do is see if a gallery will take it (not auction), who will then rip off some unsuspecting rich idiot.

Thank you for your valuation. As I told you, I already have some offers above that ballpark.
About the "unsuspecting rich idiot", please refer to the answer to the previous point. I am sure many people would consider several bits of your collection to be overpriced and many wouldn't understand why some glicée prints are sold for thousands, if they can achieve something very similar using their Epson printers. Does that make you or me an unsuspecting idiot? I hope not.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

GLWTS

I am quite sure you didn't mean it, but thank you.

[Acme Thunderer]

Nov 3, 2024 23:26:12 GMT 1 tinku said:

I promised myself not to answer in a detailed way to Acme Thunderer because of two main reasons:
- I didn't want to play the used car salesman's role
- I didn't think he really believed most of the things he wrote, as almost all of them were easily rebatable

However, as this has become everything but a sales post and as he continues to ask for explanations, I will spend some time doing so.

Before getting into that, I want to thank Londown 01 . He clearly believes the asking price is high and, however, he is smart and honest enough to look for valid arguments to make his point (which include, as any intelligent criticism, contradictions like those auction results for similar items that, in a low market, hit results that are significantly higher than those suggested by others).

Now, let's get into it:

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

Just to bring this thread back to some kind of reality…

- It’s a nice novelty item.

I can agree with this. The piece is quite new and it is not the best time to sell it. I am well aware of this, and I know that I would be getting more if I keep it for longer.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- The piece is a freebie given away at an exhibition so the value will be reflective of this as it had no value beforehand.

This answer has two parts:
- First of all, when I think about freebies, what comes to my mind are those items you normally sell: napkins, leaflets, etc. that are handed out at exhibitions, that are printed in the thousands and that become memoralia as time passes. Perhaps it is just my poor English (it is my third language). These were indeed given out for free, to people who answered a trivia properly. I don't think that makes them "freebies", as I feel this term is slightly derogatory. They are art pieces, just that analogous pieces that were originally sold, either we like them or not (I personally don't like spin paintings that much, so we probably coincide in that judgement).
- Leaving aside my self-taught artist side, and talking as an economist, I think you are confusing price with value. These items didn't have a price beforehand. However, they did have value.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- Damien Hirst signed items are not rare (as it is harder to find something unsigned).

I guess unsigned pieces are selling well, then. Many collectors love rare items.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- It is not a commercially released work so you will not get someone specifically wanting it.

People can "specifically want" things that are not commercially released. In fact, most of the things I "specifically want" in my life aren't commercially released. What kind of argument is this?

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- As the image is specific to Mexico, then the demand from outside Mexico will be limited.

I will also answer to this in three parts:
- We could argue Mexico is probably (and is increasingly becoming) a cultural capital of the world (one of them, obviously not the main one). This makes Mexican culture universal (or planetary, to be more fair with the intelligent life that might exist elsewhere).
- We could also argue that all culture is universal, which would make the above point unnecessary. Plenty of artworks that depict realities that are not those we live in can still be valid in our places. Do you need me to list some examples or you can think about some by yourself?
- Even if both previous points are not true, I think any serious Hirst collector or critique would know about the influence that Mexico has on his works. He has a studio in Mexico City and some pieces like "For the love of God" (one of his most important ones) are inspired by Mexican culture (in that case, by Mexica skull inserts). Such is the Jacarandas series. He has said himself that he feels more comfortable in Mexico than in the UK, because of the role death plays in Mexican culture. Mexican motifs are then also Hirst's motifs, and therefore reflect something about his work and not just something about the country.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- Snakes are not wall-friendly (especially if they look like they will shortly be eaten).

I guess this is pretty subjective and I guess some people can like the image. I probably wouldn't hang some of the stuff you have in your collection and you probably wouldn't hang some of the stuff I have in mine. However, as I said, I don't find a Vietnamese girl being burnt with napalm to be wall-friendly, and in this specific case I do find it distressing to think about some people "liking" this image. However, I do understand the importance of the piece Banksy did, what he meant with it and therefore why some people have it hanged in their living rooms.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- We have not seen anyone else try to sell one from the exhibition and if it was going to be an in-demand item during the exhibition, the flippers would have been all over it.

I guess this is also cultural. In Mexico Hirst is not as well known as in the Anglo-Saxon world, and neither is flipping such a common practice. These pieces couldn't be bought online; you had to be at the museum to get them. They were also given out with a very short notice: one day, the Jumex Museum announced that the first 500 to answer a trivia correctly were going to take one home on the next day (most people were surprised to be asked questions when they left the exhibition, as this was not widely communicated). I believe most of these spin paintings went to curious families who visited the museum early on that day and who managed to get the trivia right, but who probably weren't familiar with Hirst's market value, to be sincere.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- As you managed to get two, this will give you an idea of how many people wanted them.

We were three, actually, and we managed to get the trivia right on our way out. We visited the Museum 10 minutes after it opened on the day the contest took place. If you have no idea about the way these were handed out, why do you jump to conclusions so easily?

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- The amount of discussion has been virtually non-existent (on here and on other art grounds/forums), so this will give you an idea of demand.

You are right about this. Hirst didn't post these pieces on his social media and, as I told you, the museum didn't make a big deal about the contest, so I believe that most people aren't even aware of their existence. I wouldn't take this forum as a reference, though. It has been quite empty lately and, judging by some comments, I start to understand why. I miss the good old days.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- If there was any demand, you would have been inundated with PM’s from people wanting to buy.

Last time I spoke with Snowden you still didn't have access to my inbox. Again, talking about things you don't know.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

- Round spin paintings (that are much nicer and wall friendly) can be bought for circa £5k.

Again, this judgement is subjective. They are, objectively, also much more common (they were produced in the thousands). I do believe that some Hirst collectors would value rarity over your own aesthetic judgement.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

My advice is not to base any valuations by Googling other Damien Hirst sales. It is like having a cough and trying to get a diagnosis from Google and then thinking you have one week left to live (i.e. it is not unreliable).

I often feel bad for people who underestimate other's intelligence. It often says more about themselves than about the people they are talking to.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

I am not low-balling, but you will only get something in the region of £500-£1,000. The best thing to do is see if a gallery will take it (not auction), who will then rip off some unsuspecting rich idiot.

Thank you for your valuation. As I told you, I already have some offers above that ballpark.
About the "unsuspecting rich idiot", please refer to the answer to the previous point. I am sure many people would consider several bits of your collection to be overpriced and many wouldn't understand why some glicée prints are sold for thousands, if they can achieve something very similar using their Epson printers. Does that make you or me an unsuspecting idiot? I hope not.

Nov 2, 2024 20:29:55 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

GLWTS

I am quite sure you didn't mean it, but thank you.

I just skimmed your reply as it looked like waffle. 🥱

You wanted advice and then not happy if someone doesn’t give you an over-inflated valuation.

As it stands, it has not sold. There are also too many offers that never materialise into sales (which is why virtually all of my purchases or sales on this forum are completed in less than 24 hours).

There are a lot of detractors with this particular piece that will mean that it will never get the price you want. I kindly highlighted these for you (with a little sarcasm) and it is your prerogative to ignore them, but it will NEVER achieve anything like other spin paintings that are round, butterfly’s or skulls.

I sincerely would like you to sell this, but please get real.

[tinku]

Nov 4, 2024 0:05:37 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

I just skimmed your reply as looked like waffle. 🥱

This explains it all. I couldn't have expected anything deep from someone who operates like that.

Nov 4, 2024 0:05:37 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

You wanted advice and then not happy if someone doesn’t give you an over-inflated valuation.

Oh, it is clear you don't know me. I am a curious person, and would have loved a smart valuation that destroyed all my expectations if it taught me something. That was not what you brought here, and as I had never interacted with you before, I was surprised to be the recipient of your frustration.

Nov 4, 2024 0:05:37 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

As it stands, it has not sold. Offers are not the same as sales as too many offers never materialise into sales.

It has not sold on this forum, yes. And it is not surprising, as not much is selling since it is so empty. I suspect people like you have contributed to that.

That is all from me in this dialogue with you, which is not such because you don't even show enough respect to read what the other has to say.

Have a good evening and try to get rid of that negative energy before going to sleep, so you can have sweet dreams.

Edit: BTW, those skulls you mention as being far superior and naturally more expensive were made by the public in Kiev and handed out for free. I guess they tick many of your boxes.

[Acme Thunderer]

Nov 4, 2024 0:29:16 GMT 1 tinku said:

Nov 4, 2024 0:05:37 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

I just skimmed your reply as looked like waffle. 🥱

This explains it all. I couldn't have expected anything deep from someone who operates like that.

Nov 4, 2024 0:05:37 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

You wanted advice and then not happy if someone doesn’t give you an over-inflated valuation.

Oh, it is clear you don't know me. I am a curious person, and would have loved a smart valuation that destroyed all my expectations. That was not what you brought here, and as I had never interacted with you before, I was surprised to be the recipient of your frustration.

Nov 4, 2024 0:05:37 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

As it stands, it has not sold. Offers are not the same as sales as too many offers never materialise into sales.

It has not sold on this forum, yes. And it is not surprising, as not much is selling since it is so empty. I suspect people like you have contributed to that.

That is all from me in this dialogue with you, which is not such because you don't even show enough respect to read what the other has to say.

Have a good evening and try to get rid of that negative energy before going to sleep, so you can have sweet dreams.

In my comments, I’ve kept it art related and said nothing personal about you so chill a bit.

I must apologise for contributing to the demise of UAA 🤣 (which I happen to think is still an important and thriving art community and will continue to be).

[tinku]

Nov 4, 2024 1:05:47 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

In my comments, I’ve kept it art related and said nothing personal about you so chill a bit.

Admitting to not reading what somebody else answered to you and considering it "waffle" without giving any reason to do so is, in my opinion, a lack of respect and a personal offense. But perhaps we were just educated differently.

Cheers!

[Acme Thunderer]

I thought I would be helpful and give this auction a friendly plug. 🙌

[tinku]

Nov 22, 2024 20:35:29 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

I thought I would be helpful and give this auction a friendly plug. 🙌

Thank you! Let's see how that goes.

[lymbc001]

ill give you $100 plus postage

[joeybcee]

I’ll go $101

I think the first one with the red is lovely. Nice piece. But I’m a biased Hirst artwork owner.