touchdowntodd
Junior Member
Posts • 1,515
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April 2017
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Donald Trump, by touchdowntodd on Aug 4, 2019 3:15:25 GMT 1, One of the common arguments seems to be if you had a weapon you could use it in self defence, doesn’t seem like many of these nuts are stopped in this fashion.
There was actually a off duty individual who assisted using his personal carry .. and there have been several in the past. Even near me, a carry conceal user stopped a robbery shooting the perpetrator in the chest as he was trying to shoot the store owner with his 3rd shot at him...
Remember many of these locations such as schools, bars, etc post no guns allowed, which is even more of an issue. It's illegal to carry in many states into liquor serving establishments, illegal on all government property, and stores can choose to post no guns allowed
One of the common arguments seems to be if you had a weapon you could use it in self defence, doesn’t seem like many of these nuts are stopped in this fashion. There was actually a off duty individual who assisted using his personal carry .. and there have been several in the past. Even near me, a carry conceal user stopped a robbery shooting the perpetrator in the chest as he was trying to shoot the store owner with his 3rd shot at him... Remember many of these locations such as schools, bars, etc post no guns allowed, which is even more of an issue. It's illegal to carry in many states into liquor serving establishments, illegal on all government property, and stores can choose to post no guns allowed
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NYart
Junior Member
Posts • 1,221
Likes • 843
January 2016
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Donald Trump, by NYart on Aug 4, 2019 3:25:56 GMT 1, One of the common arguments seems to be if you had a weapon you could use it in self defence, doesn’t seem like many of these nuts are stopped in this fashion. There was actually a off duty individual who assisted using his personal carry .. and there have been several in the past. Even near me, a carry conceal user stopped a robbery shooting the perpetrator in the chest as he was trying to shoot the store owner with his 3rd shot at him... Remember many of these locations such as schools, bars, etc post no guns allowed, which is even more of an issue. It's illegal to carry in many states into liquor serving establishments, illegal on all government property, and stores can choose to post no guns allowed
Yepp, the good guys who could be carrying aren’t allowed to, and respect the law, but signs don’t stop bad guys. I know more guns sounds scary to a lot of people, and won’t try to say accidents couldn’t happen. But no one starts shooting people because it was convenient for them. “Well I got upset and happened to have my legal concealed carry weapon so I started shooting.” That just doesn’t happen. I believe 9 times out of 10 if a good guy has a gun, and an incident occurs, it’ll be them using it for good over an accident happening or a crime being committed with said weapon.
I certainly can’t believe anyone who found themselves caught up in a tragedy like this one would complain an armed citizen was there and able to intervene. Why make well intentioned individuals jump through hurdles to potentially make a difference? A gun safety class? Passing a test? For sure, but registration, applications, interviews, and references is a bit much.
One of the common arguments seems to be if you had a weapon you could use it in self defence, doesn’t seem like many of these nuts are stopped in this fashion. There was actually a off duty individual who assisted using his personal carry .. and there have been several in the past. Even near me, a carry conceal user stopped a robbery shooting the perpetrator in the chest as he was trying to shoot the store owner with his 3rd shot at him... Remember many of these locations such as schools, bars, etc post no guns allowed, which is even more of an issue. It's illegal to carry in many states into liquor serving establishments, illegal on all government property, and stores can choose to post no guns allowed Yepp, the good guys who could be carrying aren’t allowed to, and respect the law, but signs don’t stop bad guys. I know more guns sounds scary to a lot of people, and won’t try to say accidents couldn’t happen. But no one starts shooting people because it was convenient for them. “Well I got upset and happened to have my legal concealed carry weapon so I started shooting.” That just doesn’t happen. I believe 9 times out of 10 if a good guy has a gun, and an incident occurs, it’ll be them using it for good over an accident happening or a crime being committed with said weapon. I certainly can’t believe anyone who found themselves caught up in a tragedy like this one would complain an armed citizen was there and able to intervene. Why make well intentioned individuals jump through hurdles to potentially make a difference? A gun safety class? Passing a test? For sure, but registration, applications, interviews, and references is a bit much.
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.dappy
Full Member
Posts • 9,835
Likes • 9,443
December 2010
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Donald Trump, by .dappy on Aug 4, 2019 4:13:09 GMT 1, ... oh dear ...
... oh dear ...
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.dappy
Full Member
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December 2010
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Donald Trump, by .dappy on Aug 4, 2019 4:16:55 GMT 1, ... except if you are at a family Garlic Festival ...
'But no one starts shooting people because it was convenient for them. “Well I got upset and happened to have my legal concealed carry weapon so I started shooting.” That just doesn’t happen'
... or if you attended a school and didn't like your fellow school mates or teachers ...
... except if you are at a family Garlic Festival ...
'But no one starts shooting people because it was convenient for them. “Well I got upset and happened to have my legal concealed carry weapon so I started shooting.” That just doesn’t happen'
... or if you attended a school and didn't like your fellow school mates or teachers ...
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Hairbland
Junior Member
Posts • 2,943
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November 2010
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Donald Trump, by Hairbland on Aug 4, 2019 5:22:01 GMT 1, Another thread where followers of the news talk out of their ass.
Another thread where followers of the news talk out of their ass.
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.dappy
Full Member
Posts • 9,835
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December 2010
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Donald Trump, by .dappy on Aug 4, 2019 5:49:01 GMT 1, ... oh dear ... the deaths of real people are talking out of our arses ...
... oh dear ... the deaths of real people are talking out of our arses ...
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irl1
Full Member
Posts • 9,274
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December 2017
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Donald Trump, by irl1 on Aug 4, 2019 12:59:21 GMT 1, Another thread where followers of the news talk out of their ass. Its gone so quite here ass talking would be welcome
Another thread where followers of the news talk out of their ass. Its gone so quite here ass talking would be welcome
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Hairbland
Junior Member
Posts • 2,943
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November 2010
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Donald Trump, by Hairbland on Aug 4, 2019 13:08:20 GMT 1, ... oh dear ... the deaths of real people are talking out of our arses ... No, the largely uneducated posts here are, the deaths are real. Try again.
... oh dear ... the deaths of real people are talking out of our arses ... No, the largely uneducated posts here are, the deaths are real. Try again.
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wrigs
New Member
Posts • 497
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July 2017
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Donald Trump, by wrigs on Aug 4, 2019 13:41:37 GMT 1, I still find it staggering that people’s genuine response to these types of events is to call for more guns??? Blows my mind. You look at the response of the Australian government after Port Arthur and how many of these events now happen there.
I still find it staggering that people’s genuine response to these types of events is to call for more guns??? Blows my mind. You look at the response of the Australian government after Port Arthur and how many of these events now happen there.
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kuni
Junior Member
Posts • 1,153
Likes • 1,818
February 2018
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Donald Trump, by kuni on Aug 4, 2019 13:45:44 GMT 1, I still find it staggering that people’s genuine response to these types of events is to call for more guns??? Blows my mind. You look at the response of the Australian government after Port Arthur and how many of these events now happen there. Same. These shootings are taking place with weapons of war and you’re really going to take that on with your revolver? The shooters are now covered in body armor from head to toe and often the result of months of planning. Good luck with that. This isn’t rocket science.
I still find it staggering that people’s genuine response to these types of events is to call for more guns??? Blows my mind. You look at the response of the Australian government after Port Arthur and how many of these events now happen there. Same. These shootings are taking place with weapons of war and you’re really going to take that on with your revolver? The shooters are now covered in body armor from head to toe and often the result of months of planning. Good luck with that. This isn’t rocket science.
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Hairbland
Junior Member
Posts • 2,943
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November 2010
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Donald Trump, by Hairbland on Aug 4, 2019 13:47:07 GMT 1, I still find it staggering that people’s genuine response to these types of events is to call for more guns??? Blows my mind. You look at the response of the Australian government after Port Arthur and how many of these events now happen there. Agreed. Eliminate all assault weapons and their add-ons then begin the discussion. Let’s see how tough these bedroom mirror p*ssies are with just a rifle or pistol.
I still find it staggering that people’s genuine response to these types of events is to call for more guns??? Blows my mind. You look at the response of the Australian government after Port Arthur and how many of these events now happen there. Agreed. Eliminate all assault weapons and their add-ons then begin the discussion. Let’s see how tough these bedroom mirror p*ssies are with just a rifle or pistol.
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kuni
Junior Member
Posts • 1,153
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February 2018
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Donald Trump, by kuni on Aug 4, 2019 13:50:20 GMT 1, I still find it staggering that people’s genuine response to these types of events is to call for more guns??? Blows my mind. You look at the response of the Australian government after Port Arthur and how many of these events now happen there. Agreed. Eliminate all assault weapons and their add-ons then begin the discussion. Let’s see how tough these bedroom mirror p*ssies with just a rifle or pistol. Right? The shooting in Dayton left 10 dead and 30 injured in UNDER A MINUTE. Just think about that.
I still find it staggering that people’s genuine response to these types of events is to call for more guns??? Blows my mind. You look at the response of the Australian government after Port Arthur and how many of these events now happen there. Agreed. Eliminate all assault weapons and their add-ons then begin the discussion. Let’s see how tough these bedroom mirror p*ssies with just a rifle or pistol. Right? The shooting in Dayton left 10 dead and 30 injured in UNDER A MINUTE. Just think about that.
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NYart
Junior Member
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January 2016
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Donald Trump, by NYart on Aug 4, 2019 15:07:49 GMT 1, Look at what was still on the streets in Australia 20 years after everything being outlawed. To believe that a motivated individual who had months of planning wouldn’t have been able to get their hands on a firearm is silly.
www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/02/28/asia/australia-gun-amnesty-intl/index.html
When people hear the (made up inaccurate terms) “weapons of war” and “assault rifles” but really don’t have any real knowledge of firearms they assume they’re something far more dangerous than an average pistol. The truth is, especially in close quarters, they’re not. Your average pistol, let’s say a Glock, is semi automatic which means it fires once per pull of the trigger and comes most commonly in two calibers 9mm and .40. Glocks also have magazines available that carry as many as 33 rounds, meaning they could possibly shoot 33 people as quickly as they could pull the trigger without even having to reload. An AR15 is also a semi automatic, one shot per pull of the trigger (it doesn’t fire faster than a pistol). The two main differences are it fires a .223 round and has better accuracy at a further distance. Neither of which are helpful for close quarters locations like all these attacks have been occurring. The .223 round is smaller than the 9mm or .40 from a pistol so actually causes less damage!
If we could feasibly eliminate every single firearm, sure there wouldn’t be mass shootings. But it wouldn’t stop a troubled individual who was motivated and premeditated to hurt as many people as possible with whatever means available. That’s where the focus should be, helping identify those people and when they are we need to be able to deal with stopping them. Too many of these people had been brought to the attention of law enforcement before their attacks and nothing was done to intervene. How and why is my question, that’s where people’s anger should lie, there’s no excuse for that. If it’s a resource issue, we need to fix that.
I’ve said my peace, won’t be posting on the subject again. Naturally there’s a lot of emotional responses to tragedies like these, but we need get past the ‘feel good fixes’ that would just provide a false sense of security.
Look at what was still on the streets in Australia 20 years after everything being outlawed. To believe that a motivated individual who had months of planning wouldn’t have been able to get their hands on a firearm is silly. www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/02/28/asia/australia-gun-amnesty-intl/index.htmlWhen people hear the (made up inaccurate terms) “weapons of war” and “assault rifles” but really don’t have any real knowledge of firearms they assume they’re something far more dangerous than an average pistol. The truth is, especially in close quarters, they’re not. Your average pistol, let’s say a Glock, is semi automatic which means it fires once per pull of the trigger and comes most commonly in two calibers 9mm and .40. Glocks also have magazines available that carry as many as 33 rounds, meaning they could possibly shoot 33 people as quickly as they could pull the trigger without even having to reload. An AR15 is also a semi automatic, one shot per pull of the trigger (it doesn’t fire faster than a pistol). The two main differences are it fires a .223 round and has better accuracy at a further distance. Neither of which are helpful for close quarters locations like all these attacks have been occurring. The .223 round is smaller than the 9mm or .40 from a pistol so actually causes less damage! If we could feasibly eliminate every single firearm, sure there wouldn’t be mass shootings. But it wouldn’t stop a troubled individual who was motivated and premeditated to hurt as many people as possible with whatever means available. That’s where the focus should be, helping identify those people and when they are we need to be able to deal with stopping them. Too many of these people had been brought to the attention of law enforcement before their attacks and nothing was done to intervene. How and why is my question, that’s where people’s anger should lie, there’s no excuse for that. If it’s a resource issue, we need to fix that. I’ve said my peace, won’t be posting on the subject again. Naturally there’s a lot of emotional responses to tragedies like these, but we need get past the ‘feel good fixes’ that would just provide a false sense of security.
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teabaggins
New Member
Posts • 930
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November 2018
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Donald Trump, by teabaggins on Aug 4, 2019 15:27:39 GMT 1, Look at what was still on the streets in Australia 20 years after everything being outlawed. To believe that a motivated individual who had months of planning wouldn’t have been able to get their hands on a firearm is silly. www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/02/28/asia/australia-gun-amnesty-intl/index.htmlWhen people hear the (made up inaccurate terms) “weapons of war” and “assault rifles” but really don’t have any real knowledge of firearms they assume they’re something far more dangerous than an average pistol. The truth is, especially in close quarters, they’re not. Your average pistol, let’s say a Glock, is semi automatic which means it fires once per pull of the trigger and comes most commonly in two calibers 9mm and .40. Glocks also have magazines available that carry as many as 33 rounds, meaning they could possibly shoot 33 people as quickly as they could pull the trigger without even having to reload. An AR15 is also a semi automatic, one shot per pull of the trigger (it doesn’t fire faster than a pistol). The two main differences are it fires a .223 round and has better accuracy at a further distance. Neither of which are helpful for close quarters locations like all these attacks have been occurring. The .223 round is smaller than the 9mm or .40 from a pistol so actually causes less damage! If we could feasibly eliminate every single firearm, sure there wouldn’t be mass shootings. But it wouldn’t stop a troubled individual who was motivated and premeditated to hurt as many people as possible with whatever means available. That’s where the focus should be, helping identify those people and when they are we need to be able to deal with stopping them. Too many of these people had been brought to the attention of law enforcement before their attacks and nothing was done to intervene. How and why is my question, that’s where people’s anger should lie, there’s no excuse for that. If it’s a resource issue, we need to fix that. I’ve said my peace, won’t be posting on the subject again. Naturally there’s a lot of emotional responses to tragedies like these, but we need get past the ‘feel good fixes’ that would just provide a false sense of security. Im not sure I’m reading your point correctly. You reference an article that shows the positive impact of tougher gun laws or gun bans all together but your argument seems to me that these new laws were not an effective solution in. Australia.
“Since reform mass shootings in Australia dropped to zero (YES ZERO), gun suicides declined by an average of 4.8% per year, and gun-related homicides declined by an average of 5.5% per year.”
As a US Citizen Id take those results as a starting off point. Then we can focus on refining further from there.
The reality is that taking the steps that Australia had taken would be the MOST effective first step they the US could take.
Look at what was still on the streets in Australia 20 years after everything being outlawed. To believe that a motivated individual who had months of planning wouldn’t have been able to get their hands on a firearm is silly. www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/02/28/asia/australia-gun-amnesty-intl/index.htmlWhen people hear the (made up inaccurate terms) “weapons of war” and “assault rifles” but really don’t have any real knowledge of firearms they assume they’re something far more dangerous than an average pistol. The truth is, especially in close quarters, they’re not. Your average pistol, let’s say a Glock, is semi automatic which means it fires once per pull of the trigger and comes most commonly in two calibers 9mm and .40. Glocks also have magazines available that carry as many as 33 rounds, meaning they could possibly shoot 33 people as quickly as they could pull the trigger without even having to reload. An AR15 is also a semi automatic, one shot per pull of the trigger (it doesn’t fire faster than a pistol). The two main differences are it fires a .223 round and has better accuracy at a further distance. Neither of which are helpful for close quarters locations like all these attacks have been occurring. The .223 round is smaller than the 9mm or .40 from a pistol so actually causes less damage! If we could feasibly eliminate every single firearm, sure there wouldn’t be mass shootings. But it wouldn’t stop a troubled individual who was motivated and premeditated to hurt as many people as possible with whatever means available. That’s where the focus should be, helping identify those people and when they are we need to be able to deal with stopping them. Too many of these people had been brought to the attention of law enforcement before their attacks and nothing was done to intervene. How and why is my question, that’s where people’s anger should lie, there’s no excuse for that. If it’s a resource issue, we need to fix that. I’ve said my peace, won’t be posting on the subject again. Naturally there’s a lot of emotional responses to tragedies like these, but we need get past the ‘feel good fixes’ that would just provide a false sense of security. Im not sure I’m reading your point correctly. You reference an article that shows the positive impact of tougher gun laws or gun bans all together but your argument seems to me that these new laws were not an effective solution in. Australia. “Since reform mass shootings in Australia dropped to zero (YES ZERO), gun suicides declined by an average of 4.8% per year, and gun-related homicides declined by an average of 5.5% per year.” As a US Citizen Id take those results as a starting off point. Then we can focus on refining further from there. The reality is that taking the steps that Australia had taken would be the MOST effective first step they the US could take.
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Donald Trump, by chickenlittle on Aug 4, 2019 15:28:14 GMT 1, Look at what was still on the streets in Australia 20 years after everything being outlawed. To believe that a motivated individual who had months of planning wouldn’t have been able to get their hands on a firearm is silly. www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/02/28/asia/australia-gun-amnesty-intl/index.htmlWhen people hear the (made up inaccurate terms) “weapons of war” and “assault rifles” but really don’t have any real knowledge of firearms they assume they’re something far more dangerous than an average pistol. The truth is, especially in close quarters, they’re not. Your average pistol, let’s say a Glock, is semi automatic which means it fires once per pull of the trigger and comes most commonly in two calibers 9mm and .40. Glocks also have magazines available that carry as many as 33 rounds, meaning they could possibly shoot 33 people as quickly as they could pull the trigger without even having to reload. An AR15 is also a semi automatic, one shot per pull of the trigger (it doesn’t fire faster than a pistol). The two main differences are it fires a .223 round and has better accuracy at a further distance. Neither of which are helpful for close quarters locations like all these attacks have been occurring. The .223 round is smaller than the 9mm or .40 from a pistol so actually causes less damage! If we could feasibly eliminate every single firearm, sure there wouldn’t be mass shootings. But it wouldn’t stop a troubled individual who was motivated and premeditated to hurt as many people as possible with whatever means available. That’s where the focus should be, helping identify those people and when they are we need to be able to deal with stopping them. Too many of these people had been brought to the attention of law enforcement before their attacks and nothing was done to intervene. How and why is my question, that’s where people’s anger should lie, there’s no excuse for that. If it’s a resource issue, we need to fix that. I’ve said my peace, won’t be posting on the subject again. Naturally there’s a lot of emotional responses to tragedies like these, but we need get past the ‘feel good fixes’ that would just provide a false sense of security.
I’m sorry, this whole argument is ridiculous for many reasons
Look at what was still on the streets in Australia 20 years after everything being outlawed. To believe that a motivated individual who had months of planning wouldn’t have been able to get their hands on a firearm is silly. www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/02/28/asia/australia-gun-amnesty-intl/index.htmlWhen people hear the (made up inaccurate terms) “weapons of war” and “assault rifles” but really don’t have any real knowledge of firearms they assume they’re something far more dangerous than an average pistol. The truth is, especially in close quarters, they’re not. Your average pistol, let’s say a Glock, is semi automatic which means it fires once per pull of the trigger and comes most commonly in two calibers 9mm and .40. Glocks also have magazines available that carry as many as 33 rounds, meaning they could possibly shoot 33 people as quickly as they could pull the trigger without even having to reload. An AR15 is also a semi automatic, one shot per pull of the trigger (it doesn’t fire faster than a pistol). The two main differences are it fires a .223 round and has better accuracy at a further distance. Neither of which are helpful for close quarters locations like all these attacks have been occurring. The .223 round is smaller than the 9mm or .40 from a pistol so actually causes less damage! If we could feasibly eliminate every single firearm, sure there wouldn’t be mass shootings. But it wouldn’t stop a troubled individual who was motivated and premeditated to hurt as many people as possible with whatever means available. That’s where the focus should be, helping identify those people and when they are we need to be able to deal with stopping them. Too many of these people had been brought to the attention of law enforcement before their attacks and nothing was done to intervene. How and why is my question, that’s where people’s anger should lie, there’s no excuse for that. If it’s a resource issue, we need to fix that. I’ve said my peace, won’t be posting on the subject again. Naturally there’s a lot of emotional responses to tragedies like these, but we need get past the ‘feel good fixes’ that would just provide a false sense of security. I’m sorry, this whole argument is ridiculous for many reasons
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NYart
Junior Member
Posts • 1,221
Likes • 843
January 2016
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Donald Trump, by NYart on Aug 4, 2019 15:38:04 GMT 1,
A .40 Glock wasn’t created to kill humans? It certainly wasn’t intended as a hunting caliber like a .223 round is. It’s best for small game, coyotes, rabbits, etc. Most hunters wouldn’t even consider it for something as large as a deer. All guns are deadly and created to kill, but each have pros and cons. For all intents and purposes a glock could shoot as many people as quickly as an AR. Especially in a close quarters environment like all these mass shootings take place in. Just because it’s often a weapon of choice doesn’t make it the best choice. In Newton Connecticut it was actually left in the shooters vehicle but naturally still took the blame.
A .40 Glock wasn’t created to kill humans? It certainly wasn’t intended as a hunting caliber like a .223 round is. It’s best for small game, coyotes, rabbits, etc. Most hunters wouldn’t even consider it for something as large as a deer. All guns are deadly and created to kill, but each have pros and cons. For all intents and purposes a glock could shoot as many people as quickly as an AR. Especially in a close quarters environment like all these mass shootings take place in. Just because it’s often a weapon of choice doesn’t make it the best choice. In Newton Connecticut it was actually left in the shooters vehicle but naturally still took the blame.
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qest
New Member
Posts • 612
Likes • 707
March 2018
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Donald Trump, by qest on Aug 4, 2019 15:52:31 GMT 1, A .40 Glock wasn’t created to kill humans? It certainly wasn’t intended as a hunting caliber like a .223 round is. It’s best for small game, coyotes, rabbits, etc. Most hunters wouldn’t even consider it for something as large as a deer. All guns are deadly and created to kill, but each have pros and cons. For all intents and purposes a glock could shoot as many people as quickly as an AR. Especially in a close quarters environment like all these mass shootings take place in. Just because it’s often a weapon of choice doesn’t make it the best choice. In Newton Connecticut it was actually left in the shooters vehicle but naturally still took the blame. You are misinformed.
web.archive.org/web/20160517175905/http://www.ct.gov/despp/cwp/view.asp?A=4226&Q=517284
Seized inside the school:
#1. Bushmaster .223 caliber-- model XM15-E2S rifle with high capacity 30 round magazine
#2. Glock 10 mm handgun
#3. Sig-Sauer P226 9mm handgun
Seized from suspect’s car in parking lot:
#4. Izhmash Canta-12 12 gauge Shotgun (seized from car in parking lot)
The shooter used the Bushmaster .223 to murder 20 children and six adults inside the school; he used a handgun to take his own life inside the school. No other weapons were used in this crime. This case remains under investigation.
Lt. J. Paul Vance
A .40 Glock wasn’t created to kill humans? It certainly wasn’t intended as a hunting caliber like a .223 round is. It’s best for small game, coyotes, rabbits, etc. Most hunters wouldn’t even consider it for something as large as a deer. All guns are deadly and created to kill, but each have pros and cons. For all intents and purposes a glock could shoot as many people as quickly as an AR. Especially in a close quarters environment like all these mass shootings take place in. Just because it’s often a weapon of choice doesn’t make it the best choice. In Newton Connecticut it was actually left in the shooters vehicle but naturally still took the blame.You are misinformed. web.archive.org/web/20160517175905/http://www.ct.gov/despp/cwp/view.asp?A=4226&Q=517284Seized inside the school: #1. Bushmaster .223 caliber-- model XM15-E2S rifle with high capacity 30 round magazine #2. Glock 10 mm handgun #3. Sig-Sauer P226 9mm handgun Seized from suspect’s car in parking lot: #4. Izhmash Canta-12 12 gauge Shotgun (seized from car in parking lot) The shooter used the Bushmaster .223 to murder 20 children and six adults inside the school; he used a handgun to take his own life inside the school. No other weapons were used in this crime. This case remains under investigation. Lt. J. Paul Vance
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NYart
Junior Member
Posts • 1,221
Likes • 843
January 2016
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Donald Trump, by NYart on Aug 4, 2019 16:06:36 GMT 1, I stand corrected, doesn’t change my belief of it being less suited to the purpose.
Really done posting here, don’t believe I’m going to change any minds. Just would encourage everyone to think how we can get to the root of the problem. Outlawing one weapon doesn’t change people are sick and need to be helped or stopped if we want them not to harm themselves and others.
I stand corrected, doesn’t change my belief of it being less suited to the purpose.
Really done posting here, don’t believe I’m going to change any minds. Just would encourage everyone to think how we can get to the root of the problem. Outlawing one weapon doesn’t change people are sick and need to be helped or stopped if we want them not to harm themselves and others.
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qest
New Member
Posts • 612
Likes • 707
March 2018
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Donald Trump, by qest on Aug 4, 2019 16:07:27 GMT 1, I stand corrected, doesn’t change my belief of it being less suited to the purpose. Really done posting here, don’t believe I’m going to change any minds. Just would encourage everyone to think how we can get to the root of the problem. Outlawing one weapon doesn’t change people are sick and need to be helped or stopped if we want them not to harm themselves and others. I know it won't change your belief. That's problematic, and there is some irony in your follow up sentence.
I stand corrected, doesn’t change my belief of it being less suited to the purpose. Really done posting here, don’t believe I’m going to change any minds. Just would encourage everyone to think how we can get to the root of the problem. Outlawing one weapon doesn’t change people are sick and need to be helped or stopped if we want them not to harm themselves and others. I know it won't change your belief. That's problematic, and there is some irony in your follow up sentence.
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NYart
Junior Member
Posts • 1,221
Likes • 843
January 2016
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Donald Trump, by NYart on Aug 4, 2019 16:13:45 GMT 1, I stand corrected, doesn’t change my belief of it being less suited to the purpose. Really done posting here, don’t believe I’m going to change any minds. Just would encourage everyone to think how we can get to the root of the problem. Outlawing one weapon doesn’t change people are sick and need to be helped or stopped if we want them not to harm themselves and others. I know it won't change your belief. That's problematic, and there is some irony in your follow up sentence. My belief isn’t stemming from others opinions or examples. I have experience with both handguns and rifles, and that’s where it stems from. I don’t have a steadfast inflexible opinion on something I’m uneducated on.
I stand corrected, doesn’t change my belief of it being less suited to the purpose. Really done posting here, don’t believe I’m going to change any minds. Just would encourage everyone to think how we can get to the root of the problem. Outlawing one weapon doesn’t change people are sick and need to be helped or stopped if we want them not to harm themselves and others. I know it won't change your belief. That's problematic, and there is some irony in your follow up sentence. My belief isn’t stemming from others opinions or examples. I have experience with both handguns and rifles, and that’s where it stems from. I don’t have a steadfast inflexible opinion on something I’m uneducated on.
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wrigs
New Member
Posts • 497
Likes • 417
July 2017
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Donald Trump, by wrigs on Aug 4, 2019 16:17:22 GMT 1, Look at what was still on the streets in Australia 20 years after everything being outlawed. To believe that a motivated individual who had months of planning wouldn’t have been able to get their hands on a firearm is silly. www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/02/28/asia/australia-gun-amnesty-intl/index.htmlWhen people hear the (made up inaccurate terms) “weapons of war” and “assault rifles” but really don’t have any real knowledge of firearms they assume they’re something far more dangerous than an average pistol. The truth is, especially in close quarters, they’re not. Your average pistol, let’s say a Glock, is semi automatic which means it fires once per pull of the trigger and comes most commonly in two calibers 9mm and .40. Glocks also have magazines available that carry as many as 33 rounds, meaning they could possibly shoot 33 people as quickly as they could pull the trigger without even having to reload. An AR15 is also a semi automatic, one shot per pull of the trigger (it doesn’t fire faster than a pistol). The two main differences are it fires a .223 round and has better accuracy at a further distance. Neither of which are helpful for close quarters locations like all these attacks have been occurring. The .223 round is smaller than the 9mm or .40 from a pistol so actually causes less damage! If we could feasibly eliminate every single firearm, sure there wouldn’t be mass shootings. But it wouldn’t stop a troubled individual who was motivated and premeditated to hurt as many people as possible with whatever means available. That’s where the focus should be, helping identify those people and when they are we need to be able to deal with stopping them. Too many of these people had been brought to the attention of law enforcement before their attacks and nothing was done to intervene. How and why is my question, that’s where people’s anger should lie, there’s no excuse for that. If it’s a resource issue, we need to fix that. I’ve said my peace, won’t be posting on the subject again. Naturally there’s a lot of emotional responses to tragedies like these, but we need get past the ‘feel good fixes’ that would just provide a false sense of security.
Notice you skirted around the point in respect of how many mass shootings have taken place since? New Zealand currently under going a similar process:
www.google.co.uk/amp/s/news.sky.com/story/amp/new-zealanders-hand-back-10-000-weapons-in-amnesty-after-mosque-attacks-11767587
You are right there will always be people that want to do others harm it’s just how easy you wish to make that. I would suggest being able to pick up a semi automatic whilst you do your weekly shop in Walmart is a little too easy at present.
Look at what was still on the streets in Australia 20 years after everything being outlawed. To believe that a motivated individual who had months of planning wouldn’t have been able to get their hands on a firearm is silly. www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2018/02/28/asia/australia-gun-amnesty-intl/index.htmlWhen people hear the (made up inaccurate terms) “weapons of war” and “assault rifles” but really don’t have any real knowledge of firearms they assume they’re something far more dangerous than an average pistol. The truth is, especially in close quarters, they’re not. Your average pistol, let’s say a Glock, is semi automatic which means it fires once per pull of the trigger and comes most commonly in two calibers 9mm and .40. Glocks also have magazines available that carry as many as 33 rounds, meaning they could possibly shoot 33 people as quickly as they could pull the trigger without even having to reload. An AR15 is also a semi automatic, one shot per pull of the trigger (it doesn’t fire faster than a pistol). The two main differences are it fires a .223 round and has better accuracy at a further distance. Neither of which are helpful for close quarters locations like all these attacks have been occurring. The .223 round is smaller than the 9mm or .40 from a pistol so actually causes less damage! If we could feasibly eliminate every single firearm, sure there wouldn’t be mass shootings. But it wouldn’t stop a troubled individual who was motivated and premeditated to hurt as many people as possible with whatever means available. That’s where the focus should be, helping identify those people and when they are we need to be able to deal with stopping them. Too many of these people had been brought to the attention of law enforcement before their attacks and nothing was done to intervene. How and why is my question, that’s where people’s anger should lie, there’s no excuse for that. If it’s a resource issue, we need to fix that. I’ve said my peace, won’t be posting on the subject again. Naturally there’s a lot of emotional responses to tragedies like these, but we need get past the ‘feel good fixes’ that would just provide a false sense of security. Notice you skirted around the point in respect of how many mass shootings have taken place since? New Zealand currently under going a similar process: www.google.co.uk/amp/s/news.sky.com/story/amp/new-zealanders-hand-back-10-000-weapons-in-amnesty-after-mosque-attacks-11767587You are right there will always be people that want to do others harm it’s just how easy you wish to make that. I would suggest being able to pick up a semi automatic whilst you do your weekly shop in Walmart is a little too easy at present.
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kuni
Junior Member
Posts • 1,153
Likes • 1,818
February 2018
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qest
New Member
Posts • 612
Likes • 707
March 2018
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Donald Trump, by qest on Aug 4, 2019 19:17:01 GMT 1, I know it won't change your belief. That's problematic, and there is some irony in your follow up sentence. My belief isn’t stemming from others opinions or examples. I have experience with both handguns and rifles, and that’s where it stems from. I don’t have a steadfast inflexible opinion on something I’m uneducated on.
This isn't about your critique of the tactics used by the gunmen, it's about their consistent choice of weapons that allow them to slaughter mass numbers of civilians. It's not hard to decipher why the same firearms keep showing up.
I know it won't change your belief. That's problematic, and there is some irony in your follow up sentence. My belief isn’t stemming from others opinions or examples. I have experience with both handguns and rifles, and that’s where it stems from. I don’t have a steadfast inflexible opinion on something I’m uneducated on. This isn't about your critique of the tactics used by the gunmen, it's about their consistent choice of weapons that allow them to slaughter mass numbers of civilians. It's not hard to decipher why the same firearms keep showing up.
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touchdowntodd
Junior Member
Posts • 1,515
Likes • 1,416
April 2017
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Donald Trump, by touchdowntodd on Aug 4, 2019 20:14:02 GMT 1, Interesting that no one anywhere is discussing the Dayton Ohio shooter being a registered Democrat..
This is a problem, and it's greater than politics.. it's more a reflection of America's lack of family than anything Imho....
This man even killed his own sister in the shooting.. a citizen assisted, the shooting lasted under 1 minute, and the shooter is dead on scene
Interesting that no one anywhere is discussing the Dayton Ohio shooter being a registered Democrat..
This is a problem, and it's greater than politics.. it's more a reflection of America's lack of family than anything Imho....
This man even killed his own sister in the shooting.. a citizen assisted, the shooting lasted under 1 minute, and the shooter is dead on scene
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Pipes
Junior Member
Posts • 2,430
Likes • 2,857
January 2012
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Donald Trump, by Pipes on Aug 4, 2019 20:41:57 GMT 1, Has the Dayton shooting been linked to politics in the same way as the Texas shooting? Ie Manifesto / dislike of immigrants / ideological in Texas massacre.
So it’s perhaps because the motive of the Texas killing is aligned to Trumps rhetoric.
Has the Dayton shooting been linked to politics in the same way as the Texas shooting? Ie Manifesto / dislike of immigrants / ideological in Texas massacre.
So it’s perhaps because the motive of the Texas killing is aligned to Trumps rhetoric.
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touchdowntodd
Junior Member
Posts • 1,515
Likes • 1,416
April 2017
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Donald Trump, by touchdowntodd on Aug 4, 2019 20:55:26 GMT 1, Bad people do bad things always have always will.
Agreed.. but for example not far from me Chicago.. much stricter gun laws that almost anywhere else in the US...
Already 1500 people shot this year, over 300 killed this year....
But we're not discussing the daily violence at all.... Why is that?
Bad people do bad things always have always will. Agreed.. but for example not far from me Chicago.. much stricter gun laws that almost anywhere else in the US... Already 1500 people shot this year, over 300 killed this year.... But we're not discussing the daily violence at all.... Why is that?
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kuni
Junior Member
Posts • 1,153
Likes • 1,818
February 2018
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Donald Trump, by kuni on Aug 4, 2019 21:03:08 GMT 1, A majority of guns used in Chicago crimes come from out of state:
www.wsj.com/articles/report-finds-most-guns-used-in-chicago-crimes-come-from-outside-city-1509310489
Not being able to walk into a Walmart and walk out with an AR-15 shouldn’t be a republican or democratic platform. Over 90% of people are in favor of stricter gun laws. There are bad and disturbed and evil people in every country...hmm I wonder what the big difference between the US and all of the other countries that don’t have this problem is? Must be the video games 🤷♂️
A majority of guns used in Chicago crimes come from out of state: www.wsj.com/articles/report-finds-most-guns-used-in-chicago-crimes-come-from-outside-city-1509310489Not being able to walk into a Walmart and walk out with an AR-15 shouldn’t be a republican or democratic platform. Over 90% of people are in favor of stricter gun laws. There are bad and disturbed and evil people in every country...hmm I wonder what the big difference between the US and all of the other countries that don’t have this problem is? Must be the video games 🤷♂️
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touchdowntodd
Junior Member
Posts • 1,515
Likes • 1,416
April 2017
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Donald Trump, by touchdowntodd on Aug 4, 2019 21:11:55 GMT 1, A majority of guns used in Chicago crimes come from out of state: www.wsj.com/articles/report-finds-most-guns-used-in-chicago-crimes-come-from-outside-city-1509310489Not being able to walk into a Walmart and walk out with an AR-15 shouldn’t be a republican or democratic platform. Over 90% of people are in favor of stricter gun laws. There are bad and disturbed and evil people in every country...hmm I wonder what the big difference between the US and all of the other countries that don’t have this problem is? Must be the video games 🤷♂️
Anyone can get a gun, in any country...
One troubling thing for me is witnesses always see multiple shooters, but police always only find one.. and the timing of these things. But that's a whole conspiracy conversation I can't buy into in regards to agreeing or not
The weapon isn't the problem.. it's deeper. These are acts planned for months. Guns will always be available, the source of the thought is all we can control
That being said.. I'll refer back to America's lack of family vs other countries. Remember statistically how much higher a 1 parent home child is to commit murder in general, but it's staggeringly high in mass shootings.. in fact I can only think of 1 that had an parent home.. in this day of social media, everyone's desire to be "known" and "loved" and the constant of not having both parents, we can easily see the root cause.. and this goes for day to day violence as well as mass..
A majority of guns used in Chicago crimes come from out of state: www.wsj.com/articles/report-finds-most-guns-used-in-chicago-crimes-come-from-outside-city-1509310489Not being able to walk into a Walmart and walk out with an AR-15 shouldn’t be a republican or democratic platform. Over 90% of people are in favor of stricter gun laws. There are bad and disturbed and evil people in every country...hmm I wonder what the big difference between the US and all of the other countries that don’t have this problem is? Must be the video games 🤷♂️ Anyone can get a gun, in any country... One troubling thing for me is witnesses always see multiple shooters, but police always only find one.. and the timing of these things. But that's a whole conspiracy conversation I can't buy into in regards to agreeing or not The weapon isn't the problem.. it's deeper. These are acts planned for months. Guns will always be available, the source of the thought is all we can control That being said.. I'll refer back to America's lack of family vs other countries. Remember statistically how much higher a 1 parent home child is to commit murder in general, but it's staggeringly high in mass shootings.. in fact I can only think of 1 that had an parent home.. in this day of social media, everyone's desire to be "known" and "loved" and the constant of not having both parents, we can easily see the root cause.. and this goes for day to day violence as well as mass..
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kuni
Junior Member
Posts • 1,153
Likes • 1,818
February 2018
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Donald Trump, by kuni on Aug 4, 2019 21:25:52 GMT 1, A majority of guns used in Chicago crimes come from out of state: www.wsj.com/articles/report-finds-most-guns-used-in-chicago-crimes-come-from-outside-city-1509310489Not being able to walk into a Walmart and walk out with an AR-15 shouldn’t be a republican or democratic platform. Over 90% of people are in favor of stricter gun laws. There are bad and disturbed and evil people in every country...hmm I wonder what the big difference between the US and all of the other countries that don’t have this problem is? Must be the video games 🤷♂️ Anyone can get a gun, in any country... One troubling thing for me is witnesses always see multiple shooters, but police always only find one.. and the timing of these things. But that's a whole conspiracy conversation I can't buy into in regards to agreeing or not The weapon isn't the problem.. it's deeper. These are acts planned for months. Guns will always be available, the source of the thought is all we can control That being said.. I'll refer back to America's lack of family vs other countries. Remember statistically how much higher a 1 parent home child is to commit murder in general, but it's staggeringly high in mass shootings.. in fact I can only think of 1 that had an parent home.. in this day of social media, everyone's desire to be "known" and "loved" and the constant of not having both parents, we can easily see the root cause.. and this goes for day to day violence as well as mass.. While technically correct that anyone can get a gun in any country, it’s prohibitively difficult to get an AR-15 in almost every developed country and even getting a semiautomatic pistol is much more challenging in many countries around the world.
Looking at the stats, it’s a pretty major leap to correlate divorce rate with propensity to kill someone with a gun. Even more so the relationship between divorce rate (or even single parent household) with a mass shooting. If this was the case, you’d expect to see almost as many gun related deaths in Germany, the UK or even France, which all have similar (albeit slightly lower) divorce rates.
Why is it so hard to draw a line from literally the ONLY major difference between the US and other developed countries, the number and easy access to guns, and the mass shootings? It’s like people want to point to video games, poverty, cold winters, hot summers, ANYTHING but the fact that it’s easy as hell to get an AK-47. I don’t understand it.
EDIT: Assault rifles don’t have be always be available. The second amendment does have limits. I own multiple guns, and I’m not anti gun. That said, I would gladly give up my right to purchase an assault rifle if it meant that these mass killers couldn’t purchase them either.
A majority of guns used in Chicago crimes come from out of state: www.wsj.com/articles/report-finds-most-guns-used-in-chicago-crimes-come-from-outside-city-1509310489Not being able to walk into a Walmart and walk out with an AR-15 shouldn’t be a republican or democratic platform. Over 90% of people are in favor of stricter gun laws. There are bad and disturbed and evil people in every country...hmm I wonder what the big difference between the US and all of the other countries that don’t have this problem is? Must be the video games 🤷♂️ Anyone can get a gun, in any country... One troubling thing for me is witnesses always see multiple shooters, but police always only find one.. and the timing of these things. But that's a whole conspiracy conversation I can't buy into in regards to agreeing or not The weapon isn't the problem.. it's deeper. These are acts planned for months. Guns will always be available, the source of the thought is all we can control That being said.. I'll refer back to America's lack of family vs other countries. Remember statistically how much higher a 1 parent home child is to commit murder in general, but it's staggeringly high in mass shootings.. in fact I can only think of 1 that had an parent home.. in this day of social media, everyone's desire to be "known" and "loved" and the constant of not having both parents, we can easily see the root cause.. and this goes for day to day violence as well as mass.. While technically correct that anyone can get a gun in any country, it’s prohibitively difficult to get an AR-15 in almost every developed country and even getting a semiautomatic pistol is much more challenging in many countries around the world. Looking at the stats, it’s a pretty major leap to correlate divorce rate with propensity to kill someone with a gun. Even more so the relationship between divorce rate (or even single parent household) with a mass shooting. If this was the case, you’d expect to see almost as many gun related deaths in Germany, the UK or even France, which all have similar (albeit slightly lower) divorce rates. Why is it so hard to draw a line from literally the ONLY major difference between the US and other developed countries, the number and easy access to guns, and the mass shootings? It’s like people want to point to video games, poverty, cold winters, hot summers, ANYTHING but the fact that it’s easy as hell to get an AK-47. I don’t understand it. EDIT: Assault rifles don’t have be always be available. The second amendment does have limits. I own multiple guns, and I’m not anti gun. That said, I would gladly give up my right to purchase an assault rifle if it meant that these mass killers couldn’t purchase them either.
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