[Deleted]

I've been hearing so many stories on here about framing disasters, and about things being stored flat vs. 'mint in tube' and cannot tell what is the best way for actually preserving the art that you buy.

Probably a really dumb question; I don't own a flatfile, but I only buy to frame so most of my stuff is framed and I have 2-3 things still in tubes. Just figured I'd ask/get a quick answer.

[Dungle]

Don't leave in a tube as they will need to be professionally flattened.

If they aren't going on the wall then keep them in an acid free sleeve in a flat file.

When framing get it done to museum standards.

[alittle]

Best way to preserve is in an acid free sleeve in a flat file.

If you decide to have a piece framed, make sure that the framer uses archival materials, and never use "archival" tape. Photo corners and traditional Japenese hinges with wheat/rice starch only.

[Deleted]

Jul 25, 2014 14:55:11 GMT 1 alittle said:

Best way to preserve is in an acid free sleeve in a flat file.

If you decide to have a piece framed, make sure that the framer uses archival materials, and never use "archival" tape. Photo corners and traditional Japenese hinges with wheat/rice starch only.

Out of curiosity, what is 'archival' tape?

I have never specified certain materials, but have always stated archival materials and emphasized that the prints were extremely valuable and should not be damaged/altered in any way. Basically museum standards, but with conservation glass instead of museum glass b/c I'm a cheapskate. Just getting paranoid after reading all these threads about drymounted classics.

[Dungle]

Jul 25, 2014 15:10:08 GMT 1 coller said:

Jul 25, 2014 14:55:11 GMT 1 alittle said:

Best way to preserve is in an acid free sleeve in a flat file.

If you decide to have a piece framed, make sure that the framer uses archival materials, and never use "archival" tape. Photo corners and traditional Japenese hinges with wheat/rice starch only.

Out of curiosity, what is 'archival' tape?

I have never specified certain materials, but have always stated archival materials and emphasized that the prints were extremely valuable and should not be damaged/altered in any way. Basically museum standards, but with conservation glass instead of museum glass b/c I'm a cheapskate. Just getting paranoid after reading all these threads about drymounted classics.

The majority of the dry mounted issues arise from people who bought the prints first hand at the start of the Banksy thing. No one knew that £100 - £200 prints would become worth thousands. As a result people just put them in standard frames, paid minimal amounts for framing, used blu tack and pins etc.

It is unlikely that anyone would be stupid enough to take a Banksy print to their framers now and not specify that they wanted it done to museum/gallery standards. It is also unlikely they would take it to any non reputable framers as they are now valuable prints and its worth spending a few hundred framing something that's worth thousands.

[alittle]

It is tape that is classed as being archival, however, I've never had it come off clean. Tons of conservation framers use it by default as it is quick to apply and provides a strong mount. I would specify more carefully to a potential framer how you would like the art mounted.

[Deleted]

Jul 25, 2014 15:15:18 GMT 1 alittle said:

It is tape that is classed as being archival, however, I've never had it come off clean. Tons of conservation framers use it by default as it is quick to apply and provides a strong mount. I would specify more carefully to a potential framer how you would like the art mounted.

Good to know, thank you!

This is one of the main things that I was concerned about; that I would go to the framers and specify archival materials, yet there would still be an issue. I'm assuming a framer wouldn't do this to a Banksy print now, just on instinct? Or is usage of that tape extremely commonplace? And if so, is it really impossible to remove cleanly? Seems like they should declassify it.

I always knew about acid-free, etc. but was recently reading about the Japanese adhesives and things like that; this is all helpful.

[opalis141]

For your prints that are not immediately framed: I don't have a flat file either--I don't have the amount of works that would warrant it. You do want to store the pieces flat though and not in a tube. I use a flat storage box from Archival Methods: www.archivalmethods.com/product/flat-storage-box

You should use buffer paper between each print, like the kind found here in order to make sure that no ink is transferred from one print to the other: www.archivalmethods.com/product/archival-tissue

Also when you first receive a print remove it from a tube and let it "relax" overnight on a flat, clean and dry surface. After that you can use glass weights on the corners to fully flatten it--as long as it is not taxing the paper (some people use cotton weights--I prefer not to use these as they can pick up oils/dirt/dust etc. Glass weights are significantly easier to clean).

[Poly Mindset]

There has been some debate on whether or not conservation acrylic can actually touch the piece of art. Glass should never touch the artwork because it contains lead which draws in moisture from the air, but acrylic contains no lead so no moisture will be drawn in, so I've heard. I have been arguing with other forum members that acrylic touching art is OK. There seems to be a difference in opinion on this but nobody has any documentation supporting their opinion. So I have been searching and searching for some authoritarian documentation from a reputable source to back up either claim. I finally found something and I must admit that I am wrong. The American Institute for Conservation of Historic and Artistic Works (AIC) has stated on their web page in an article entitled Caring for Your Treasures that, " Whether you chose glass or acrylic, always be sure that the glazing material does not come into direct contact with the surface of the artifact. Prolonged contact of the glazing with the surface of the artifact can result in its adhesion to the glazing, or can cause surface changes in the work. A thick mat or a spacer in the frame will keep the artifact from touching the glazing".  I have proven myself wrong for the benefit of other forum members and no longer feel worthy of being on this forum. So to all the forum members who I have gotten to know and love so dearly, I must tearfully say goodbye.

Just kidding Mother F&#%ers. This is the best forum ever and I'll never leave.

[Deleted]

definitely know about touching the glass/glazing; but interesting to know re: acrylics. more concerned about completely unforeseen things i.e. the 'archival tape' mentioned above

[Trevorm]

A friend of mine, Kevin, is close to perfecting a 100% safe conservation frame where the piece of artwork is absolutely suspended in a total vacuum. In this environment, so he tells me, the piece of artwork won't touch any part of the frame, backing or glass/acrylic.

The current drawback on the prototype model is that his mum keeps demanding the 'Henry' back for hoovering purposes + it's fairly noisy.

On a slightly more serious note I have a pair of silkscreen prints (by Nora Slocombe) from the late 70's that were both framed at the time with museum glass. On inspection fairly recently - they haven't been on the wall for about 8 or 9 years - there is clear evidence of the effects of light on one print more than the other - I'm sure they weren't hanging in direct sunlight but one was obviously more susceptible than the other. Make sure that you keep your special prints and pictures in the gloom!!

[Deleted]

Jul 25, 2014 16:01:25 GMT 1 Trevorm said:

A friend of mine, Kevin, is close to perfecting a 100% safe conservation frame where the piece of artwork is absolutely suspended in a total vacuum. In this environment, so he tells me, the piece of artwork won't touch any part of the frame, backing or glass/acrylic.

The current drawback on the prototype model is that his mum keeps demanding the 'Henry' back for hoovering purposes + it's fairly noisy.

On a slightly more serious note I have a pair of silkscreen prints (by Nora Slocombe) from the late 70's that were both framed at the time with museum glass. On inspection fairly recently - they haven't been on the wall for about 8 or 9 years - there is clear evidence of the effects of light on one print more than the other - I'm sure they weren't hanging in direct sunlight but one was obviously more susceptible than the other. Make sure that you keep your special prints and pictures in the gloom!!

In between two windows is the best; then you have the sun coming in around the piece and everything.

[Nick]

I would recomend using mylar photo corners or mylar mounting strips, that way there is zero adhesive touching the artwork. The print will just fit snug within them and the mount will cover everthing.
Obviously if floating you need a different technique!
I frame myslef but framers tend to be aware of this product and if they are not you can always take them in/ask them to purchase them.

www.dickblick.com/products/lineco-see-thru-mounting-strips/

[bullysonzx10r]

Definitely go out and grab a flat file/ portfolio. I picked up one that holds up to a 40x60 print. I think I bought it for 60-70$? Aside from that, grab two large pieces of acid free foam board and buy some acid free sleeves. Anything you don't frame, flatten out for a day or two, put it in a sleeve, place between the two foam boards, tape them shut and flat, and put it in the flat file.

You'll understand how much of a pain in the ass it is to flatten a print out if you ever go to get it floated and have had it in the tube for months.

[Deleted]

Jul 25, 2014 17:05:13 GMT 1 bullysonzx10r said:

Definitely go out and grab a flat file/ portfolio. I picked up one that holds up to a 40x60 print. I think I bought it for 60-70$? Aside from that, grab two large pieces of acid free foam board and buy some acid free sleeves. Anything you don't frame, flatten out for a day or two, put it in a sleeve, place between the two foam boards, tape them shut and flat, and put it in the flat file.

You'll understand how much of a pain in the ass it is to flatten a print out if you ever go to get it floated and have had it in the tube for months.

Got it; any chance you can point me to where you can score a flat file like that for that price?

Also even if the flattening is a pain in the ass, it isn't irreversible damage right?

[bullysonzx10r]

I just bought mine at an art shop in upstate NY.

I know amazon has some decent deals, and you could probably find one in NYC at one of the shops down their as well. It might be closer to $100-$120, but it's worth it. I literally had a run of 8 different prints that I really liked and wanted come up in probably a little over a month, and I wasn't in a position to get them all framed right when they arrived, it saved me a lot of hassle.

[opalis141]

Jul 25, 2014 17:07:47 GMT 1 coller said:

Jul 25, 2014 17:05:13 GMT 1 bullysonzx10r said:

Definitely go out and grab a flat file/ portfolio. I picked up one that holds up to a 40x60 print. I think I bought it for 60-70$? Aside from that, grab two large pieces of acid free foam board and buy some acid free sleeves. Anything you don't frame, flatten out for a day or two, put it in a sleeve, place between the two foam boards, tape them shut and flat, and put it in the flat file.

You'll understand how much of a pain in the ass it is to flatten a print out if you ever go to get it floated and have had it in the tube for months.

Got it; any chance you can point me to where you can score a flat file like that for that price?

Also even if the flattening is a pain in the ass, it isn't irreversible damage right?

Not necessarily irreversible but it can be very very difficult to flatten a print safely without overextending the fibers in the paper if it has been stored in a tube for a very long time.

[Con Art Studio]

Jul 25, 2014 14:50:46 GMT 1 coller said:

I've been hearing so many stories on here about framing disasters, and about things being stored flat vs. 'mint in tube' and cannot tell what is the best way for actually preserving the art that you buy.

Probably a really dumb question; I don't own a flatfile, but I only buy to frame so most of my stuff is framed and I have 2-3 things still in tubes. Just figured I'd ask/get a quick answer.

you haven't asked a question

[Deleted]

What about preserving originals on wood? Any thoughts?

And thanks for all the advice so far; even more helpful than expected.

[Deleted]

Jul 25, 2014 21:29:42 GMT 1 Con Art Studio said:

Jul 25, 2014 14:50:46 GMT 1 coller said:

I've been hearing so many stories on here about framing disasters, and about things being stored flat vs. 'mint in tube' and cannot tell what is the best way for actually preserving the art that you buy.

Probably a really dumb question; I don't own a flatfile, but I only buy to frame so most of my stuff is framed and I have 2-3 things still in tubes. Just figured I'd ask/get a quick answer.

you haven't asked a question

LOL

[Deleted]

Jul 25, 2014 21:55:44 GMT 1 coller said:

What about preserving originals on wood? Any thoughts?

And thanks for all the advice so far; even more helpful than expected.

More details required. Flat piece like the DFace / WTM ones or 3D Sculpture like the Henry Moore ones?.

[Deleted]

Flat piece; just won a Hanksy original on wood haha (I know I know), figured I'd ask out of curiosity.

Basically finished wood with paint on it, flat. I have it on my shelf.

[Dungle]

Jul 25, 2014 22:10:41 GMT 1 coller said:

Flat piece; just won a Hanksy original on wood haha (I know I know), figured I'd ask out of curiosity.

Basically finished wood with paint on it, flat. I have it on my shelf.

I have a xenz on wood coming from his latest show which is on a wooden crate. I'm probably gonna get it framed up.

[Deleted]

Wouldnt bother touching it, leave as is, its not open to the elements, what wood is it?, dont get it too warm or a shake will appear if its too dry, give it a wax but dont buff it.

All the above is what I would do.

[Deleted]

Jul 25, 2014 22:13:12 GMT 1 Dungle said:

Jul 25, 2014 22:10:41 GMT 1 coller said:

Flat piece; just won a Hanksy original on wood haha (I know I know), figured I'd ask out of curiosity.

Basically finished wood with paint on it, flat. I have it on my shelf.

I have a xenz on wood coming from his latest show which is on a wooden crate. I'm probably gonna get it framed up.

Don't plan on framing this, being realistic. Just gonna stay where it is (pic below)

[.dappy]

... leave it fresh hanging by itself ... put it in a tray frame ... or my fave: I like a bit of perspex box different styles depending on the piece ... floated or plain box ... perspex will protect and block out c90%+ of UV light (you can get special UV coatings for higher)

[Deleted]

Throw it in an irish peat bog its great at preserving things especially dead bodies....i dont do this, just watched a documentary on it...or stick it in a frame
#dont listen to this

[alittle]

Might want to look in to hermetically sealing that one to preserve it for future generations.

[.dappy]

... or cover it in bark ... I have a few trees locally that are hundreds of years old and still look lovely ...

[jettad]

Jul 25, 2014 22:23:42 GMT 1 .dappy said:

... leave it fresh hanging by itself ... put it in a tray frame ... or my fave: I like a bit of perspex box different styles depending on the piece ... floated or plain box ... perspex will protect and block out c90%+ of UV light (you can get special UV coatings for higher)

Hopefully I am not hijacking the thread with this question….

I recently got a RAE original (my first original), and it is 30 x 30 inches, and 2 inches deep. Would you recommend putting it in a perspex box or just hang it out of direct sunlight? I wouldn't put it in a tray frame as it has got great sides and I'd want to see those. If I went with a perspex box, is that something a framer could do? (I guess I should ask my framer, but am interested in your perspex box experiences).

Thanks