[artlike]

Feb 14, 2024 9:46:30 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

Whilst UAA should never be considered the barometer on whether art is any good, the fact that there is only 5 pages for a Damien Hirst release (and wholly negative) should give anyone with half a brain cell a clue that these are not good investments.

You are clearly triggered by the small edition size relative to previois Hirst/Heni successful and unsuccessful releases (from a buyers perspective). I don't think that makes it ok that you start trolling people who like the prints. Also doesn't excuse you posting more misinformation. Your entire art collection is down 50% in value in the past year. Nobody is telling you what a bad investment it was. 
Hopefully you enjoyed having them on your wall.

[Londown 01]

Feb 14, 2024 10:20:03 GMT 1 artlike said:

Feb 14, 2024 9:46:30 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

Whilst UAA should never be considered the barometer on whether art is any good, the fact that there is only 5 pages for a Damien Hirst release (and wholly negative) should give anyone with half a brain cell a clue that these are not good investments.

You are clearly triggered by the small edition size relative to previois Hirst/Heni successful and unsuccessful releases (from a buyers perspective). I don't think that makes it ok that you start trolling people who like the prints.

A (so called) low edition size was always to be expected with these: bad economy, flooded and saturated market, bad images, terrible technique. I don't think anyone is now surprised or "triggered"

[Brittany's Urban]

For anyone who has ever purchased one of those editions from HENI on "Laminated Giclée print on aluminium composite panel", we all know how bad it looks on the wall. The reflection is awful.

There has been some editions which have well performed (large edition and good secondary results) but I would be surprised if anyone could say they enjoy having it on the wall (unless they found a way to limit the reflection with framing and non reflective glass on top)...

[SFBM]

Feb 14, 2024 10:46:35 GMT 1 Brittany's Urban said:

For anyone who has ever purchased one of those editions from HENI on "Laminated Giclée print on aluminium composite panel", we all know how bad it looks on the wall. The reflection is awful.

There has been some editions which have well performed (large edition and good secondary results) but I would be surprised if anyone could say they enjoy having it on the wall (unless they found a way to limit the reflection with framing and non reflective glass on top)...

I have a Virtues framed behind museum glass and I don’t have any reflection issues. I am very happy with it.

[Acme Thunderer]

Feb 14, 2024 10:20:03 GMT 1 artlike said:

Feb 14, 2024 9:46:30 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

Whilst UAA should never be considered the barometer on whether art is any good, the fact that there is only 5 pages for a Damien Hirst release (and wholly negative) should give anyone with half a brain cell a clue that these are not good investments.

You are clearly triggered by the small edition size relative to previois Hirst/Heni successful and unsuccessful releases (from a buyers perspective). I don't think that makes it ok that you start trolling people who like the prints. Also doesn't excuse you posting more misinformation. Your entire art collection is down 50% in value in the past year. Nobody is telling you what a bad investment it was. 
Hopefully you enjoyed having them on your wall.

What a strange reply. You must have bought a few. 😉

My opinion is the same regardless of edition size that Heni dibond are now a bad investment.

I only post facts or my opinions and do not spread misinformation. If someone doesn’t have the same opinion as you that is not trolling. You might actually learn something by gauging collectors perspectives.

I’m not losing money on what I bought as for the last 20 years I only buy what (or can afford) I want on my walls and not purely influenced by what something is worth or can be sold for.

[Fuzzyduck121]

Shocking looking things reflected in the edition size

All the marketing on the planet couldn’t muster up more than 300 or so people to actually buy them

Assuming most people bought multiples the total output is miniscule

This doesn’t demonstrate a future investment value but more an indicator of a massive lack of demand vs an unlimited supply

[kfroms]

Feb 14, 2024 10:53:05 GMT 1 SFBM said:

Feb 14, 2024 10:46:35 GMT 1 Brittany's Urban said:

For anyone who has ever purchased one of those editions from HENI on "Laminated Giclée print on aluminium composite panel", we all know how bad it looks on the wall. The reflection is awful.

There has been some editions which have well performed (large edition and good secondary results) but I would be surprised if anyone could say they enjoy having it on the wall (unless they found a way to limit the reflection with framing and non reflective glass on top)...

I have a Virtues framed behind museum glass and I don’t have any reflection issues. I am very happy with it.

I always chuckle when I read that. 
Forking out a fortune for a colourful mirror and than having to fork out another fortune to mitigate the massive flaw. 
Happy you are happy tho. 

[Dice]

Feb 14, 2024 11:12:37 GMT 1 Fuzzyduck121 said:

Shocking looking things reflected in the edition size

All the marketing on the planet couldn’t muster up more than 300 or so people to actually buy them

Assuming most people bought multiples the total output is miniscule

This doesn’t demonstrate a future investment value but more an indicator of a massive lack of demand vs an unlimited supply

It’s more of an indicator that the images just aren’t that great 

[SFBM]

Feb 14, 2024 11:14:24 GMT 1 kfroms said:

Feb 14, 2024 10:53:05 GMT 1 SFBM said:

I have a Virtues framed behind museum glass and I don’t have any reflection issues. I am very happy with it.

I always chuckle when I read that. 
Forking out a fortune for a colourful mirror and than having to fork out another fortune to mitigate the massive flaw. 
Happy you are happy tho. 

I forked out a fortune as it was an expensive piece and I wanted to protect it. Do you put your Banksys on the wall with drawing pins? Idiot

[Pawel]

This is getting a bit out of hand.
1. This is a very low edition for a Heni open edition Hirst print. That will help on the secondary but nobody knows by how much. It's bery much possible people just got tired with all the releases and decided to be more picky. It will be interesting what will be the next edition size.
2. I had H4 print and the glare never bothered me. The flatness of the image did.
3. I wouldn't call them a classic First images by any stretch, but these are miles more wall friendly than Empresses. If I recall correctly Empresses where released shortly after Virtues had started to reach 20k on secondary.

[kfroms]

Feb 14, 2024 11:53:20 GMT 1 SFBM said:

Feb 14, 2024 11:14:24 GMT 1 kfroms said:

I always chuckle when I read that. 
Forking out a fortune for a colourful mirror and than having to fork out another fortune to mitigate the massive flaw. 
Happy you are happy tho. 

I forked out a fortune as it was an expensive piece and I wanted to protect it. Do you put your Banksys on the wall with drawing pins? Idiot

Your use of language shows who the idiot is I guess. 

anyway, moving on. 

[artenthusiast241]

They will do well when art starts to hit the mainstrean just in the same way watches did 5 years ago. Previously watches were a hobbie amongst the connoisseurs until the mainstream caught it and prices ramped up significantly. Art has yet to reach that level but is slowly moving towards it and both damien hirst and heni clearly have the vision of making it more accessible. There are 1m rolex watches manufactured a year yet demand exceeds supply and here we are shouting because 300 is considered too high of an edition size. Focus on the big picture. Crypto just hit 2trn market cap today. Once more millionaires are minted, the cash will follow again to real utility assets like watches and art. Pick your winners early on now. Also I heard rumours that damien will stop these drops when he reaches “H20” in order to preserve the credibility of the art economy.

[Londown 01]

Feb 14, 2024 13:04:17 GMT 1 artenthusiast241 said:

Once more millionaires are minted, the cash will follow again to real utility assets like watches and art.

Why did you register under "artenthusiast"? 

[its all about me]

Feb 13, 2024 20:01:07 GMT 1 stendhal said:

Final Numbers:
H14-1 - Realisation: 395
H14-2 - Happiness: 327
H14-3 - Tolerance: 402
H14-4 - Wisdom: 319
H14-5 - Reassurance: 312
H14-6 - Resolution: 383
H14-7 - Selflessness: 578
H14-8 - Knowledge: 413

pretty so so…

Gosh!  For a blue chip artist and a timed edition, those numbers are really poor. How the mighty have fallen.  

[artenthusiast241]

Where the land meets the sea - ugly drop yet selling at almost +50% on secondary only 3 days ago.

For sure we will see minimum 2x on these secret garden ones that are way more relatable to the mainstream.

Sorry some of you sulkers missed out….

[Poster Bob]

Feb 14, 2024 14:44:16 GMT 1 artenthusiast241 said:

Where the land meets the sea - ugly drop yet selling at almost +50% on secondary only 3 days ago.

For sure we will see minimum 2x on these secret garden ones that are way more relatable to the mainstream.

Sorry some of you sulkers missed out….

Sorry some of you posters selectively, instead of systematically review auction results. A bloodbath on Artnet, and on eBay: unsold Woody Bay; unsold Blizzard; unsold Studland Bay; £3.95k for a Studland Bay; unsold Kynance; unsold Kynance; unsold Woody Bay; unsold Blizzard; unsold Studland Bay; unsold Kynance; unsold Kingsdown Beach; £2.75k for Mill Bay; unsold Kynance; unsold Woody Bay; unsold Blizzard; unsold Studland; unsold Woody Bay; unsold Mill Bay; unsold Kynance; unsold Blizzard; unsold Kingsdown Beach; unsold Studland; unsold Woody Bay: unsold Mill Bay; unsold Kynance; unsold Blizzard; unsold Kingsdown Beach; unsold Studland; and unsold Woody Bay.

Thumbs up on examining all of the evidence and providing the necessary background and caveats. I’d normally provide some to the above, but with this audience it’s mostly a waste of time. 

[Acme Thunderer]

Feb 14, 2024 14:44:16 GMT 1 artenthusiast241 said:

Where the land meets the sea - ugly drop yet selling at almost +50% on secondary only 3 days ago.

For sure we will see minimum 2x on these secret garden ones that are way more relatable to the mainstream.

Sorry some of you sulkers missed out….

WOW - that is a great sale. I see the seller was from the UK and not the US.

The release price from Heni was $3,500, which works out at £2,800.

Then there is 20% vat @ £560 = £3,360 plus approx £60 for delivery, so the total cost for the seller was £3,420.

This was a sale on eBay UK, so as this sold for £3,950, the eBay UK fee is £505.90, which means the buyer gets £3,440.10.

The seller made a profit of £24.10. 😉

You’re right - I am gutted to have missed out.

[Poster Bob]

Feb 14, 2024 15:12:43 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

Feb 14, 2024 14:44:16 GMT 1 artenthusiast241 said:

Where the land meets the sea - ugly drop yet selling at almost +50% on secondary only 3 days ago.

For sure we will see minimum 2x on these secret garden ones that are way more relatable to the mainstream.

Sorry some of you sulkers missed out….

WOW - that is a great sale. I see the seller was from the UK and not the US.

The release price from Heni was $3,500, which works out at £2,800.

Then there is 20% vat @ £560 = £3,360 plus approx £60 for delivery, so the total cost for the seller was £3,420.

This was a sale on eBay UK, so as this sold for £3,950, the eBay UK fee is £505.90, which means the buyer gets £3,440.10.

The seller made a profit of £24.10. 😉

You’re right - I am gutted to have missed out.

I would have assumed that the seller, like anyone in their right mind, only lists items when offered a 70% (or more) off of fees promotion. If you combine that, with the maximum fee cap of £250, you can assume that they only paid £75 in fees if the item sold for the full asking price.

[artenthusiast241]

It is a good sale. Regardless of the fees, tax, fx rates, the fact of the matter is that there was a willing buyer in the US who paid +50% above rrp for it. That gives you an indication that there is demand at above retail prices. But more importantly that was a very ugly drop that 75% of the mainstream probably would not feel comfortable hanging on their walls. The secrets on the other hand is a completely different aesthetic - 75% would feel comfortable having it on their walls. The $3.5k drop price hasn’t increased since 2020 when inflation since then has been about +30% minimum - another additional gain. All of this will add up in the long term guys

[Majestic]

I think this release got the collective treatment it deserved.

Low numbers not an indicator of desirability, but the clearest message yet that Heni need to revise its current model and stop spewing out mass produced garbage. 

[blurp]

Feb 14, 2024 18:05:52 GMT 1 Majestic said:

I think this release got the collective treatment it deserved.

Low numbers not an indicator of desirability, but the clearest message yet that Heni need to revise its current model and stop spewing out mass produced garbage. 

[nobokov]

It's a funny thing with timed editions. You can release a picture of a turd as a timed edition which would result in very few people buying it, and those buying it would be happy thinking that they have rare artwork. But at the same time the people who didn't buy it would be happy that they didn't spend money on a picture of a turd.

[artlike]

Feb 14, 2024 18:52:39 GMT 1 nobokov said:

It's a funny thing with timed editions. You can release a picture of a turd as a timed edition which would result in very few people buying it, and those buying it would be happy thinking that they have rare artwork. But at the same time the people who didn't buy it would be happy that they didn't spend money on a picture of a turd.

I think if you buy it because you like it and want to enjoy it on your wall, then whatever the image you probably would want the lowest edition possible all else considered. Or you just wouldn't care about the edition size.


That's the problem with you people, all you think about when you see releases is "can I make money on it? ". Which is why there's a lot of bitterness around. As you've all been destroyed in the last couple of years and it's only getting worse. 

[nobokov]

Feb 14, 2024 20:13:03 GMT 1 artlike said:

Feb 14, 2024 18:52:39 GMT 1 nobokov said:

It's a funny thing with timed editions. You can release a picture of a turd as a timed edition which would result in very few people buying it, and those buying it would be happy thinking that they have rare artwork. But at the same time the people who didn't buy it would be happy that they didn't spend money on a picture of a turd.

I think if you buy it because you like it and want to enjoy it on your wall, then whatever the image you probably would want the lowest edition possible all else considered. Or you just wouldn't care about the edition size.


That's the problem with you people, all you think about when you see releases is "can I make money on it? ". Which is why there's a lot of bitterness around. As you've all been destroyed in the last couple of years and it's only getting worse. 

You people? "Now don't be racist, old sport."

I think my post emphasized on how ugly the images are and not the boodles of cash to be had.

[Smokeidaeye]

Feb 14, 2024 13:04:17 GMT 1 artenthusiast241 said:

They will do well when art starts to hit the mainstrean just in the same way watches did 5 years ago. Previously watches were a hobbie amongst the connoisseurs until the mainstream caught it and prices ramped up significantly. Art has yet to reach that level but is slowly moving towards it and both damien hirst and heni clearly have the vision of making it more accessible. There are 1m rolex watches manufactured a year yet demand exceeds supply and here we are shouting because 300 is considered too high of an edition size. Focus on the big picture. Crypto just hit 2trn market cap today. Once more millionaires are minted, the cash will follow again to real utility assets like watches and art. Pick your winners early on now. Also I heard rumours that damien will stop these drops when he reaches “H20” in order to preserve the credibility of the art economy.

I actually just came from my dentist's office and he was commenting how he had hoped to pick one of these up for his waiting room but thought they were undervalued given the fact that they come with a signed sticker. Instead he skipped the 2 week "open edition" window and is now keeping an eye on StockX for the first listings so he can make his fair market mainstream offer of $7k (in cryptocurrency, of course).

[Pawel]

Feb 14, 2024 20:57:10 GMT 1 Smokeidaeye said:

Feb 14, 2024 13:04:17 GMT 1 artenthusiast241 said:

They will do well when art starts to hit the mainstrean just in the same way watches did 5 years ago. Previously watches were a hobbie amongst the connoisseurs until the mainstream caught it and prices ramped up significantly. Art has yet to reach that level but is slowly moving towards it and both damien hirst and heni clearly have the vision of making it more accessible. There are 1m rolex watches manufactured a year yet demand exceeds supply and here we are shouting because 300 is considered too high of an edition size. Focus on the big picture. Crypto just hit 2trn market cap today. Once more millionaires are minted, the cash will follow again to real utility assets like watches and art. Pick your winners early on now. Also I heard rumours that damien will stop these drops when he reaches “H20” in order to preserve the credibility of the art economy.

I actually just came from my dentist's office and he was commenting how he had hoped to pick one of these up for his waiting room but thought they were undervalued given the fact that they come with a signed sticker. Instead he skipped the 2 week "open edition" window and is now keeping an eye on StockX for the first listings so he can make his fair market mainstream offer of $7k (in cryptocurrency, of course).

Tell them to get some Sweettoof instead. Perfect for a dentist.

[kfroms]

Two interesting articles on Artscapy re the DH market:

artscapy.com/page/view-post?id=238&mtm_campaign=2023-email&mtm_source=newsletter&mtm_medium=article&mtm_cid=1000&utm_source=Artscapy&utm_campaign=6b7c12865a-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2023_05_09_11_04_COPY_01&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_-197891c545-%5BLIST_EMAIL_ID%5D

artscapy.com/page/view-post?id=235&mtm_campaign=2023-email&mtm_source=newsletter&mtm_medium=article&mtm_cid=1000&utm_source=Artscapy&utm_campaign=6b7c12865a-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2023_05_09_11_04_COPY_01&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_-197891c545-%5BLIST_EMAIL_ID%5D

[ubl]

Feb 14, 2024 13:12:55 GMT 1 its all about me said:

Feb 13, 2024 20:01:07 GMT 1 stendhal said:

Final Numbers:
H14-1 - Realisation: 395
H14-2 - Happiness: 327
H14-3 - Tolerance: 402
H14-4 - Wisdom: 319
H14-5 - Reassurance: 312
H14-6 - Resolution: 383
H14-7 - Selflessness: 578
H14-8 - Knowledge: 413

pretty so so…

Gosh!  For a blue chip artist and a timed edition, those numbers are really poor. How the mighty have fallen.  

Ex-blue chip. He is Ikea grade at best now. He will be filling up the rooms in Premier Inn's with his art soon if he keeps up the food work.

[Smokeidaeye]

Feb 15, 2024 21:28:25 GMT 1 ubl said:

Feb 14, 2024 13:12:55 GMT 1 its all about me said:

Gosh!  For a blue chip artist and a timed edition, those numbers are really poor. How the mighty have fallen.  

Ex-blue chip. He is Ikea grade at best now. He will be filling up the rooms in Premier Inn's with his art soon if he keeps up the food work.

Fortunately for Hirst fans, he has pre-signed 100,000 stickers so like Dali, they can continue to crank out aluminum dibond prints long after his passing.

[LJCal]

If anyone wants to really understand how completely fucked these Hirst Heni prints are I'd encourage them to drop me a message. I broker pretty much all of his Heni releases regularly (on average 5-7 a month), and have watched his market get worse and worse with each release. And at the worst possible time, as demand is shrinking due to monetary tightening and higher interest rates the supply of these prints just goes up and up (whilst the quality seems to move in the opposite direction).

What needs to be appreciated, is that the bulk of people buying these are dealers and galleries, and they are sitting on HUGE inventories. I've been to several warehouses and lockups of various galleries/dealers and they are filled to bursting with Heni releases the majority Hirst timed releases. All of this will have to get absorbed and there comes a point where dealers will cut their losses and dump their inventory to release cash that will either provide a better return elsewhere or be used to keep the lights on. This has been happening gradually over the last 2 years but the flood gates have opened in the last 6 months.

Don't for one second think that this drop is a small edition, it's not at all. A small select group of buyers will want to hang these in their home, I'd be surprised if more than 10-20% bought primary for this reason, the rest have been bought to sell on and will just add to the already huge supply of unopened Heni prints stacked in a lock-up.

The smart money is dumping any and all Hirst giclees (there's some money to be had scalping off the really cheap ones if you can move them straight on), I think Virtues will likely settle at £8k and the rest will be selling at a discount to cost for some time (these included), even the older and better screenprints and woodcuts have come down a lot, these make for better investment but don't even expect these to hold their value in the short term (in other words make sure you buy well and can afford to hold for 3-4 years). Unless something completely unexpected happens you don't need a crystal ball to call this, it's already happening and will get worse before there's any kind of recovery (and that will be years off).

I know this will piss some people off but it's reality - sorry. You can either get mad or maybe look at these with fresh eyes, move them on and put the money into something better (cash under the mattress is even a better option imo).