Orange Order Rat - Fake or Real Banksy?

[met]

Orange Order Rat, Springfield Court, Glasgow, June 2023 (now buffed)

Fake Banksy or Real Banksy?










Three-day poll ending at 12 noon (UK time) on Wednesday, 28 June 2023.

Curious to learn the considered views of others here.



References to 0% and 100% have been omitted. Those options would only be appropriate for members who actually know the truth because they have inside knowledge, i.e. a connection with either Banksy or the Banksy copycat, as the case may be.

Instead, this poll is for members who don't have such inside knowledge, and are making their own judgement call about the likelihood of authenticity, based on:

(a)  their examinations/analyses of the former street piece; and/or

(b)  the weight they attribute to what they've been told or read online, on social media, or via traditional media — including apparent statements from a spokesperson for Banksy, the Cut & Run exhibition's publicists, and Glasgow City Council, all claiming the rat was not a Banksy.


Press sources:***

[Acme Thunderer]

Much of Banksy's work is about the actual placement and it’s environment.

Being tucked down a quiet alleyway should raise concerns about its authenticity more than the actual artwork itself.

Would love it to be genuine, but afraid the location is too poorly chosen.

[Carl Cashman Art]

Said no straight away, it's a bit ideas soup and doesn't really make sense. Using The Sun is a bit dated/obvious for someone like Banksy.

[Jules Leotard]

Jun 25, 2023 4:51:44 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

Much of Banksy's work is about the actual placement and it’s environment.

Being tucked down a quiet alleyway should raise concerns about its authenticity more than the actual artwork itself.

Would love it to be genuine, but afraid the location is too poorly chosen.

Great points.  More likely done by someone who was concerned about getting nabbed.  B is always very bold with placement albeit I assume he has a certain level of 'immunity' these days.

[Pete the Post]

Lol is that a grand down yet met?

[inefficiency of]

Jun 21, 2023 12:30:20 GMT 1 inefficiency of said:

I don’t get the reference to the Sun paper? Seems a good stencil, but just don’t think it makes much sense to put this up with very little context when you have a big Exhibition focusing on your stencils. I’d imagine he would be a little more elaborate than this. But.. I’ve been wrong before.

Despite you putting some good arguments forward and referencing other work he has claimed, which did cast more doubt on my decision. I’m going to stand by my initial thought (which is Similar to Carls). Nice piece, but lacks a certain clarity and context. Would like to be wrong though.

[Lroy]

Met, I have been surprised that you call this thread " real or fake " Banksy !

It's a great and lovely stencil, funny, with movement, colors, we like it, everybody like it, etc... But can we call it a " fake " ?
No, as it's not a reproduction of an artwork made by Banksy.
So, you should call this thread, " Orange Rat "- sigh -, or Brass Band Rat : Banksy or who else ?

As Acme Thunderer said, location is a bit poor, as if the artist wanted to avoid trouble, and made it low to the ground, on a door ( as other fakes ( real fakes as they used Banksy stencils ), in a street, in Galsgow, In Scotland, etc...

As I said previously, I never saw any " real " Banksy close to one of his exhibition ( apart Boti, but it was the game ) . This one also is a lot political and shows a broken bass drum hold by a rat ( drunk ? as in all the comics characters showing old school parades - picture by Hergé ) during a orange walk. This rat is nailed and caught by a mouse trap. So what is the message ? " For " or " against " ?

I think that this painting has been done by a sacarstic artist, probably Scottish or thinking to Irish Loyalists, this stencil is too much obvious, political ( in the bad way, I will say, mocking people ), and does nt took any distanciation, a Banksy speciality, and fabric " brand " ... ( see the pidgeons ) ...

My question would be only : Why ?


edit : I reckon that this rat is worth a thread. And is famous now. Thank you Met.

[bookends]

Jun 25, 2023 4:51:44 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

Much of Banksy's work is about the actual placement and it’s environment.

Being tucked down a quiet alleyway should raise concerns about its authenticity more than the actual artwork itself.

Would love it to be genuine, but afraid the location is too poorly chosen.

Not really with his rats though...they always used to pop up anywhere !!

You too are also clueless for a fanboy @

[Happy Shopper]

Style looks right, but content feels slightly off.
Would Banksy have involved himself in a sectarian issue, and included the orange sash? Feels wrong.
Also that the rat is a collage of a previous rat stencil is a red flag.

[ubl]

Personally find the image too ambiguous to be a Banksy. His imagery is usually quite clear about the meaning, having an almost a childlike clarity. The setting doesn't look right either, it doesn't play into the environment as his other works do, it's not interacting with anything around it. Which makes it loose its Banksy "wit". And the Rat seems to be a standard rat found on the internet, it doesn't react to being hit by the mouse trap at all.
The stencil style looks about right but its missing some more gradients in it for me personally.

[lukas01]

Good rat!... Executed well!
Positioned in a side street with fewer pedestrians to photograph it during execution. If you want, I'll call Banksy... to ask if he can make another one in the centre!... What do you say? 😎











<b> 100%

[Acme Thunderer]

Jun 25, 2023 10:53:03 GMT 1 bookends said:

Jun 25, 2023 4:51:44 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

Much of Banksy's work is about the actual placement and it’s environment.

Being tucked down a quiet alleyway should raise concerns about its authenticity more than the actual artwork itself.

Would love it to be genuine, but afraid the location is too poorly chosen.

Not really with his rats though...they always used to pop up anywhere !!

You too are also clueless for a fanboy @

Exactly, he… “used to” …and not for the last decade! Welcome to 2023. 😉

[its all about me]

I think there should be another option in this poll; "Does it matter?"

I find it interesting that Glasgow council have quickly removed it because they think it is not a real Banksy but presumably, they would now be protecting it in perspex if they thought it was.

Surely something should be judged on its own merits, not on who painted it.

I still don't know why they removed it, to be honest.

[Random Ginger Bloke]

It's had already been sprayed over before the council got to it...

[bookends]

Jun 25, 2023 11:32:35 GMT 1 Acme Thunderer said:

Jun 25, 2023 10:53:03 GMT 1 bookends said:

Not really with his rats though...they always used to pop up anywhere !!

You too are also clueless for a fanboy @

Exactly, he… “used to” …and not for the last decade! Welcome to 2023. 😉

Isnt the show a retrospective ? 

[drip]

One of the best ways to get the original artist to come forward on this, perhaps, is for someone to start selling merch with that image on it. Claim it's yours. Stick it on mugs, canvas prints, mouse mats, the lot. Banksy might not chase you, but a less financially stable artist might.

[tidybut]

Surprised nobodies claimed it yet mind with all the publicity its gathered 🤷‍♂️

[Sam Am]

[Not 4 The Thril]

While each piece is meant to have a different style- it may be worth taking a look at the handwriting/hand style of the piece in question in comparison to others. Curious to hear any thoughts on this.  

[jambor6]

Somthings off I’ve seen 2 different images of the painted piece floating around




In the one image it says THE SUN and on the other just SUN …also the top left segment of the hat in one image it’s red the other blank but on the tagged picture where someone’s sprayed over the piece the hat segment is still blank ..

I originally thought someone went back to clean the piece up .. now I’m thinking someone photoshopped the original painting as it didn’t turn out how they wanted it to so on that note my vote is it’s not a BANKSY

[Sam Am]

Is anyone even listening ? It’s not Banksy it’s this guy

[mrmentalhealth]

I didn’t paint the stencil in Glasgow I painted this one

[bookends]

Jun 25, 2023 13:45:43 GMT 1 Sam Am said:

Is anyone even listening ? It’s not Banksy it’s this guy

Jeeez another bozo thats looks but doesnt see

[Terry Fuckwitt]

Jun 25, 2023 13:45:43 GMT 1 Sam Am said:

Is anyone even listening ? It’s not Banksy it’s this guy

You're clearly not🤣 He's just cut a stencil from the original. 
I love this thread... 

[mrmentalhealth]

Still see bookends is as miserable as ever 🤪

[eyectopus]

jambor6 very well spotted. The image shared initially could have been before the final touch ups and finishing. Maybe a mix up by whoever took the photos. Or someone went back to quickly do the touch ups after the initial photo was taken.

[Sam Am]

I’m enjoying the fact I am completely wrong 😅 

[mrmentalhealth]

[eyectopus]

Jun 25, 2023 14:18:57 GMT 1 mrmentalhealth said:

That rules out my theory of touch ups and order of photos

[drip]

Anyone tried personally emailing Pest Control about this? I'm sure the intern would appreciate the chance to talk to someone outside the compound.