Deleted
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January 1970
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by Deleted on Aug 18, 2015 14:36:00 GMT 1, I think one crucial element has been left out of this conversation regarding art. So far we have: "buy what you love" and "buy the better investment". We have forgotten the most important element: "Buy what your spouse or significant other will actually let you hang in your home." haha, so long as she's in the process from the start, you should be okay.
I think one crucial element has been left out of this conversation regarding art. So far we have: "buy what you love" and "buy the better investment". We have forgotten the most important element: "Buy what your spouse or significant other will actually let you hang in your home." haha, so long as she's in the process from the start, you should be okay.
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Deleted
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January 1970
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by Deleted on Aug 18, 2015 14:59:48 GMT 1, What an awful thread
What an awful thread
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South Bound
Junior Member
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May 2014
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by South Bound on Aug 18, 2015 16:07:55 GMT 1, I think one crucial element has been left out of this conversation regarding art. So far we have: "buy what you love" and "buy the better investment". We have forgotten the most important element: "Buy what your spouse or significant other will actually let you hang in your home." haha, so long as she's in the process from the start, you should be okay.ย most of the time, there is some covert activity in order to buy my Paul Insects and Invaders. They get framed and hung... Then I go into the doghouse for a few days and she goes shopping.
But you do what you gotta do.
I think one crucial element has been left out of this conversation regarding art. So far we have: "buy what you love" and "buy the better investment". We have forgotten the most important element: "Buy what your spouse or significant other will actually let you hang in your home." haha, so long as she's in the process from the start, you should be okay.ย most of the time, there is some covert activity in order to buy my Paul Insects and Invaders. They get framed and hung... Then I go into the doghouse for a few days and she goes shopping. But you do what you gotta do.
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Deleted
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January 1970
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by Deleted on Aug 18, 2015 16:35:34 GMT 1, haha, so long as she's in the process from the start, you should be okay. most of the time, there is some covert activity in order to buy my Paul Insects and Invaders. They get framed and hung... Then I go into the doghouse for a few days and she goes shopping. But you do what you gotta do. haha. We have no space, so if I buy, something else goes away. I'd be double in the dog house if she wasnt involved from the beginning.
Luckily, the wife loves insect and was the driving force behind the two I bought this year
haha, so long as she's in the process from the start, you should be okay. most of the time, there is some covert activity in order to buy my Paul Insects and Invaders. They get framed and hung... Then I go into the doghouse for a few days and she goes shopping. But you do what you gotta do. haha. We have no space, so if I buy, something else goes away. I'd be double in the dog house if she wasnt involved from the beginning. Luckily, the wife loves insect and was the driving force behind the two I bought this year
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South Bound
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,483
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May 2014
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by South Bound on Aug 18, 2015 17:09:26 GMT 1, most of the time, there is some covert activity in order to buy my Paul Insects and Invaders. They get framed and hung... Then I go into the doghouse for a few days and she goes shopping. But you do what you gotta do. haha. We have no space, so if I buy, something else goes away. I'd be double in the dog house if she wasnt involved from the beginning.ย Luckily, the wife loves insect and was the driving force behind the two I bought this year ย you are a lucky man.
most of the time, there is some covert activity in order to buy my Paul Insects and Invaders. They get framed and hung... Then I go into the doghouse for a few days and she goes shopping. But you do what you gotta do. haha. We have no space, so if I buy, something else goes away. I'd be double in the dog house if she wasnt involved from the beginning.ย Luckily, the wife loves insect and was the driving force behind the two I bought this year ย you are a lucky man.
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monsoonking
New Member
Posts โข 143
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July 2011
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by monsoonking on Aug 19, 2015 22:52:25 GMT 1, In the spirit of maddoghoek100 's posts, it's instructive to look through recent print auctions when considering multiples as an "investment".
For example:
www.christies.com/lotfinder/salebrowse.aspx?intsaleid=24453&viewType=list&num=90&action=paging&pg=3
This reads like a who's who of the most prominent artists of the 20th century. Rauschenberg, Johns, Miro, Picasso, Stella, Close, Katz, Baldessari, Lichtenstein, Warhol; most going for less than $10,000.
Even old masters like Durer, Rembrandt, and Goya commonly sell for $5k-$20k.
Unless you bought these artists when they were absolute unknowns, your nominal return has been minimal, and your real return negative. This during a period that most sober observers would charitably call a tremendous bull market in art, and very possibly the latest manifestation of the tulip bulb craze.
Paying $5,000-$10,000 for a contemporary high-flier is likely to end in tears. Even if your horse ends up in the canon of historically important artists, prices are likely to appreciate little from here. If your artist falls out of favor, you'll be facing a $90%+ loss.
I'd be shocked if you can't buy a KAWS for a couple hundred bucks in 20 years. That's not a commentary on KAWS' art, it's just a statistical likelihood. In the meantime, you're just playing the greater fool game. Good luck.
FWIW, my favorite piece in my collection is a print I purchased for $175 from a mid-century abstractionist who used to show with guys like Rothko, Morris Louis, and Ken Noland, but has since fallen out of favor (and that's saying something as I've spent five figure on individual works). I actually think rediscovering forgotten artist and getting amazing work for a pittance is a lot more rewarding and fun than getting into bidding wars for the hottest artist du jour. It's easy to lose perspective in the echo chamber of modern media.
In the spirit of maddoghoek100 's posts, it's instructive to look through recent print auctions when considering multiples as an "investment". For example: www.christies.com/lotfinder/salebrowse.aspx?intsaleid=24453&viewType=list&num=90&action=paging&pg=3This reads like a who's who of the most prominent artists of the 20th century. Rauschenberg, Johns, Miro, Picasso, Stella, Close, Katz, Baldessari, Lichtenstein, Warhol; most going for less than $10,000. Even old masters like Durer, Rembrandt, and Goya commonly sell for $5k-$20k. Unless you bought these artists when they were absolute unknowns, your nominal return has been minimal, and your real return negative. This during a period that most sober observers would charitably call a tremendous bull market in art, and very possibly the latest manifestation of the tulip bulb craze. Paying $5,000-$10,000 for a contemporary high-flier is likely to end in tears. Even if your horse ends up in the canon of historically important artists, prices are likely to appreciate little from here. If your artist falls out of favor, you'll be facing a $90%+ loss. I'd be shocked if you can't buy a KAWS for a couple hundred bucks in 20 years. That's not a commentary on KAWS' art, it's just a statistical likelihood. In the meantime, you're just playing the greater fool game. Good luck. FWIW, my favorite piece in my collection is a print I purchased for $175 from a mid-century abstractionist who used to show with guys like Rothko, Morris Louis, and Ken Noland, but has since fallen out of favor (and that's saying something as I've spent five figure on individual works). I actually think rediscovering forgotten artist and getting amazing work for a pittance is a lot more rewarding and fun than getting into bidding wars for the hottest artist du jour. It's easy to lose perspective in the echo chamber of modern media.
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Deleted
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January 1970
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by Deleted on Aug 20, 2015 10:31:07 GMT 1, The Koons, Yellow Dog for 8K is sold through the Museum.
Is it a collectors plate?
I can't see it going up in value a lot.
The rich won't want it as it's only an 8K object and the not so rich won't take a chance on it.
Kaws is fashionable to some and not sure how much of a statement it is in the future.
Banksy is valid yeaterday and tomorrow, as in socio political and looking at Artnet, he isn't even in the top 100 selling artists as in high prices.
The Chinese "Bling Dynasty" could end in the near future and many rich Chinese who are buying Chinese artists could move to buying more European artists as a longer term investment.
The Koons, Yellow Dog for 8K is sold through the Museum.
Is it a collectors plate?
I can't see it going up in value a lot.
The rich won't want it as it's only an 8K object and the not so rich won't take a chance on it.
Kaws is fashionable to some and not sure how much of a statement it is in the future.
Banksy is valid yeaterday and tomorrow, as in socio political and looking at Artnet, he isn't even in the top 100 selling artists as in high prices.
The Chinese "Bling Dynasty" could end in the near future and many rich Chinese who are buying Chinese artists could move to buying more European artists as a longer term investment.
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coller
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,380
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April 2015
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by coller on Aug 28, 2015 0:09:01 GMT 1, Just found out that Koons was quoted saying he has never wielded a paintbrush in his life, and more or less never creates his own works physically. So yeah, that might lead to a backlash once he stops being "cool."
The below article was actually a pretty great summary of what draws people to certain art/artists, from the Atlantic:
www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2014/07/what-is-art/372281/
Things they focus on: -ambiguity in the work's meaning (yes Koons, yes Kaws, maybe Banksy) -ambiguity surrounding the artist in general (no Koons, yes Kaws, yes Banksy) -artist's backstory (no Koons, maybe Kaws, yes Banksy) -artist's eccentricities, unless fraudulent (no Koons, maybe Kaws, yes Banksy) -lack of negative emotions elicited by the work (yes Koons, maybe Kaws, maybe Banksy) -repeat viewing of a particular image (yes Koons, maybe Kaws, yes Banksy)
If we count each "yes" above as one point and each "maybe" as a half point, then the artist's scores are below:
Koons = 3 points Kaws = 4 points Banksy = 5 points
Take that as you will.
Just found out that Koons was quoted saying he has never wielded a paintbrush in his life, and more or less never creates his own works physically. So yeah, that might lead to a backlash once he stops being "cool." The below article was actually a pretty great summary of what draws people to certain art/artists, from the Atlantic: www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2014/07/what-is-art/372281/Things they focus on: -ambiguity in the work's meaning (yes Koons, yes Kaws, maybe Banksy) -ambiguity surrounding the artist in general (no Koons, yes Kaws, yes Banksy) -artist's backstory (no Koons, maybe Kaws, yes Banksy) -artist's eccentricities, unless fraudulent (no Koons, maybe Kaws, yes Banksy) -lack of negative emotions elicited by the work (yes Koons, maybe Kaws, maybe Banksy) -repeat viewing of a particular image (yes Koons, maybe Kaws, yes Banksy) If we count each "yes" above as one point and each "maybe" as a half point, then the artist's scores are below: Koons = 3 points Kaws = 4 points Banksy = 5 points Take that as you will.
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Black Apple Art
Art Gallery
Junior Member
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September 2013
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by Black Apple Art on Aug 28, 2015 3:16:07 GMT 1, Just found out that Koons was quoted saying he has never wielded a paintbrush in his life, and more or less never creates his own works physically. So yeah, that might lead to a backlash once he stops being "cool." The below article was actually a pretty great summary of what draws people to certain art/artists, from the Atlantic: www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2014/07/what-is-art/372281/Things they focus on: -ambiguity in the work's meaning (yes Koons, yes Kaws, maybe Banksy) -ambiguity surrounding the artist in general (no Koons, yes Kaws, yes Banksy) -artist's backstory (no Koons, maybe Kaws, yes Banksy) -artist's eccentricities, unless fraudulent (no Koons, maybe Kaws, yes Banksy) -lack of negative emotions elicited by the work (yes Koons, maybe Kaws, maybe Banksy) -repeat viewing of a particular image (yes Koons, maybe Kaws, yes Banksy) If we count each "yes" above as one point and each "maybe" as a half point, then the artist's scores are below: Koons = 3 points Kaws = 4 points Banksy = 5 points Take that as you will. Not sure if you have seen the documentaries on Koons but I actually found his backstory quite interesting even though I find absolutely zero interest in his work. I especially liked how he was enamored with Salvador Dalรญ and how finally meeting him when young changed his life. That aside, I find it hard to compare Banksy to either of them as there are so many significant factors that make him stand out in a category of his own where are other artists can be grouped in other like categories rather easily. Just MO.
Just found out that Koons was quoted saying he has never wielded a paintbrush in his life, and more or less never creates his own works physically. So yeah, that might lead to a backlash once he stops being "cool." The below article was actually a pretty great summary of what draws people to certain art/artists, from the Atlantic: www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2014/07/what-is-art/372281/Things they focus on: -ambiguity in the work's meaning (yes Koons, yes Kaws, maybe Banksy) -ambiguity surrounding the artist in general (no Koons, yes Kaws, yes Banksy) -artist's backstory (no Koons, maybe Kaws, yes Banksy) -artist's eccentricities, unless fraudulent (no Koons, maybe Kaws, yes Banksy) -lack of negative emotions elicited by the work (yes Koons, maybe Kaws, maybe Banksy) -repeat viewing of a particular image (yes Koons, maybe Kaws, yes Banksy) If we count each "yes" above as one point and each "maybe" as a half point, then the artist's scores are below: Koons = 3 points Kaws = 4 points Banksy = 5 points Take that as you will. Not sure if you have seen the documentaries on Koons but I actually found his backstory quite interesting even though I find absolutely zero interest in his work. I especially liked how he was enamored with Salvador Dalรญ and how finally meeting him when young changed his life. That aside, I find it hard to compare Banksy to either of them as there are so many significant factors that make him stand out in a category of his own where are other artists can be grouped in other like categories rather easily. Just MO.
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by Coach on Aug 28, 2015 11:39:33 GMT 1, According to the star rating system on the main page Kaws has 4 stars and banksy has 5. Does that settle it? Fwiw I still think we should remove those stars as they are, in my humble, offensive to the artists who have been rated, and serve no constructive purpose. Said so at the time too.
According to the star rating system on the main page Kaws has 4 stars and banksy has 5. Does that settle it? Fwiw I still think we should remove those stars as they are, in my humble, offensive to the artists who have been rated, and serve no constructive purpose. Said so at the time too.
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monsoonking
New Member
Posts โข 143
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July 2011
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by monsoonking on Aug 31, 2015 21:50:19 GMT 1, Just found out that Koons was quoted saying he has never wielded a paintbrush in his life, and more or less never creates his own works physically. So yeah, that might lead to a backlash once he stops being "cool."
I don't know. I feel like people have gotten comfortable with the fact that art has moved into the realm of the conceptual. Impugning Koons' work for being fabricated by others is sort of like criticizing an architect for not donning a hard hat and manning the crane.
Did anyone ask whether KAWS executed his own screenprints or how much of Dismaland Banksy was actually involved in constructing himself? I don't think anyone cares.
Just found out that Koons was quoted saying he has never wielded a paintbrush in his life, and more or less never creates his own works physically. So yeah, that might lead to a backlash once he stops being "cool."
I don't know. I feel like people have gotten comfortable with the fact that art has moved into the realm of the conceptual. Impugning Koons' work for being fabricated by others is sort of like criticizing an architect for not donning a hard hat and manning the crane. Did anyone ask whether KAWS executed his own screenprints or how much of Dismaland Banksy was actually involved in constructing himself? I don't think anyone cares.
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coller
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,380
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April 2015
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by coller on Aug 31, 2015 22:17:15 GMT 1, Just found out that Koons was quoted saying he has never wielded a paintbrush in his life, and more or less never creates his own works physically. So yeah, that might lead to a backlash once he stops being "cool."
I don't know. I feel like people have gotten comfortable with the fact that art has moved into the realm of the conceptual. Impugning Koons' work for being fabricated by others is sort of like criticizing an architect for not donning a hard hat and manning the crane. Did anyone ask whether KAWS executed his own screenprints or how much of Dismaland Banksy was actually involved in constructing himself? I don't think anyone cares. I think people care; it's largely what separates a manufacturing brand from an artist. It's cute when Duchamp does it, since you can see the genius. I feel like Koons in particular has works that tend to be much less impressive in concept and more impressive in execution.
Just found out that Koons was quoted saying he has never wielded a paintbrush in his life, and more or less never creates his own works physically. So yeah, that might lead to a backlash once he stops being "cool."
I don't know. I feel like people have gotten comfortable with the fact that art has moved into the realm of the conceptual. Impugning Koons' work for being fabricated by others is sort of like criticizing an architect for not donning a hard hat and manning the crane. Did anyone ask whether KAWS executed his own screenprints or how much of Dismaland Banksy was actually involved in constructing himself? I don't think anyone cares. I think people care; it's largely what separates a manufacturing brand from an artist. It's cute when Duchamp does it, since you can see the genius. I feel like Koons in particular has works that tend to be much less impressive in concept and more impressive in execution.
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Black Apple Art
Art Gallery
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September 2013
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by Black Apple Art on Aug 31, 2015 23:29:59 GMT 1, Just found out that Koons was quoted saying he has never wielded a paintbrush in his life, and more or less never creates his own works physically. So yeah, that might lead to a backlash once he stops being "cool."
I don't know. I feel like people have gotten comfortable with the fact that art has moved into the realm of the conceptual. Impugning Koons' work for being fabricated by others is sort of like criticizing an architect for not donning a hard hat and manning the crane. Did anyone ask whether KAWS executed his own screenprints or how much of Dismaland Banksy was actually involved in constructing himself? I don't think anyone cares. For me the big difference here is while Koons is selling pieces for the mid eight figures and Kaws is releasing $5000k print sets and designing MTV award shows, Banksy on the other hand is spending millions of his own money, drawing attention to global issues, provoking thought with street pieces, BOTI and now Dismaland with literally nothing for sale, while entertain millions for free. Hard to even put them in the same category or compare them. As I have said before... There has never been an art figure like him in history and he is doing the exact opposite that most is his position would do. I think many overlook these aspects and the impact these factors will have not only going forward but when future generations look back on his body of work.
Just found out that Koons was quoted saying he has never wielded a paintbrush in his life, and more or less never creates his own works physically. So yeah, that might lead to a backlash once he stops being "cool."
I don't know. I feel like people have gotten comfortable with the fact that art has moved into the realm of the conceptual. Impugning Koons' work for being fabricated by others is sort of like criticizing an architect for not donning a hard hat and manning the crane. Did anyone ask whether KAWS executed his own screenprints or how much of Dismaland Banksy was actually involved in constructing himself? I don't think anyone cares. For me the big difference here is while Koons is selling pieces for the mid eight figures and Kaws is releasing $5000k print sets and designing MTV award shows, Banksy on the other hand is spending millions of his own money, drawing attention to global issues, provoking thought with street pieces, BOTI and now Dismaland with literally nothing for sale, while entertain millions for free. Hard to even put them in the same category or compare them. As I have said before... There has never been an art figure like him in history and he is doing the exact opposite that most is his position would do. I think many overlook these aspects and the impact these factors will have not only going forward but when future generations look back on his body of work.
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coller
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,380
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April 2015
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by coller on Aug 31, 2015 23:42:59 GMT 1, I don't know. I feel like people have gotten comfortable with the fact that art has moved into the realm of the conceptual. Impugning Koons' work for being fabricated by others is sort of like criticizing an architect for not donning a hard hat and manning the crane. Did anyone ask whether KAWS executed his own screenprints or how much of Dismaland Banksy was actually involved in constructing himself? I don't think anyone cares. For me the big difference here is while Koons is selling pieces for the mid eight figures and Kaws is releasing $5000k print sets and designing MTV award shows, Banksy on the other hand is spending millions of his own money, drawing attention to global issues, provoking thought with street pieces, BOTI and now Dismaland with literally nothing for sale, while entertain millions for free. Hard to even put them in the same category or compare them. As I have said before... There has never been an art figure like him in history and he is doing the exact opposite that most is his position would do. I think many overlook these aspects and the impact these factors will have not only going forward but when future generations look back on his body of work. Banksy is an entirely different animal than Koons or Kaws; I hope that goes without saying for most on here. Different from any artist, really. I mean, that's what brought us all here.
If I found myself on a forum for months/years talking about Kaws or Koons, then I feel I'd have to re-examine my life. I don't feel that way about Banksy at all.
I don't know. I feel like people have gotten comfortable with the fact that art has moved into the realm of the conceptual. Impugning Koons' work for being fabricated by others is sort of like criticizing an architect for not donning a hard hat and manning the crane. Did anyone ask whether KAWS executed his own screenprints or how much of Dismaland Banksy was actually involved in constructing himself? I don't think anyone cares. For me the big difference here is while Koons is selling pieces for the mid eight figures and Kaws is releasing $5000k print sets and designing MTV award shows, Banksy on the other hand is spending millions of his own money, drawing attention to global issues, provoking thought with street pieces, BOTI and now Dismaland with literally nothing for sale, while entertain millions for free. Hard to even put them in the same category or compare them. As I have said before... There has never been an art figure like him in history and he is doing the exact opposite that most is his position would do. I think many overlook these aspects and the impact these factors will have not only going forward but when future generations look back on his body of work. Banksy is an entirely different animal than Koons or Kaws; I hope that goes without saying for most on here. Different from any artist, really. I mean, that's what brought us all here. If I found myself on a forum for months/years talking about Kaws or Koons, then I feel I'd have to re-examine my life. I don't feel that way about Banksy at all.
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monsoonking
New Member
Posts โข 143
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July 2011
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by monsoonking on Sept 1, 2015 16:33:36 GMT 1, In Koon's case, I feel like the manufactured quality of his art is part and parcel with his message. He explores manufactured kitsch, mass media messaging, and disposable consumer goods. If anything, using his own "brushstrokes" would express earnestness and detract from the irony and cynicism of his work.
In Koon's case, I feel like the manufactured quality of his art is part and parcel with his message. He explores manufactured kitsch, mass media messaging, and disposable consumer goods. If anything, using his own "brushstrokes" would express earnestness and detract from the irony and cynicism of his work.
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Deleted
Posts โข 0
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January 1970
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by Deleted on Sept 6, 2015 14:54:56 GMT 1, I don't know. I feel like people have gotten comfortable with the fact that art has moved into the realm of the conceptual. Impugning Koons' work for being fabricated by others is sort of like criticizing an architect for not donning a hard hat and manning the crane. Did anyone ask whether KAWS executed his own screenprints or how much of Dismaland Banksy was actually involved in constructing himself? I don't think anyone cares. For me the big difference here is while Koons is selling pieces for the mid eight figures and Kaws is releasing $5000k print sets and designing MTV award shows, Banksy on the other hand is spending millions of his own money, drawing attention to global issues, provoking thought with street pieces, BOTI and now Dismaland with literally nothing for sale, while entertain millions for free. Hard to even put them in the same category or compare them. As I have said before... There has never been an art figure like him in history and he is doing the exact opposite that most is his position would do. I think many overlook these aspects and the impact these factors will have not only going forward but when future generations look back on his body of work. Gotta fact check. He sold a few things, and is selling a few things. Hes just not flashy.
I don't know. I feel like people have gotten comfortable with the fact that art has moved into the realm of the conceptual. Impugning Koons' work for being fabricated by others is sort of like criticizing an architect for not donning a hard hat and manning the crane. Did anyone ask whether KAWS executed his own screenprints or how much of Dismaland Banksy was actually involved in constructing himself? I don't think anyone cares. For me the big difference here is while Koons is selling pieces for the mid eight figures and Kaws is releasing $5000k print sets and designing MTV award shows, Banksy on the other hand is spending millions of his own money, drawing attention to global issues, provoking thought with street pieces, BOTI and now Dismaland with literally nothing for sale, while entertain millions for free. Hard to even put them in the same category or compare them. As I have said before... There has never been an art figure like him in history and he is doing the exact opposite that most is his position would do. I think many overlook these aspects and the impact these factors will have not only going forward but when future generations look back on his body of work. Gotta fact check. He sold a few things, and is selling a few things. Hes just not flashy.
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Black Apple Art
Art Gallery
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,007
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September 2013
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by Black Apple Art on Sept 6, 2015 17:30:53 GMT 1, For me the big difference here is while Koons is selling pieces for the mid eight figures and Kaws is releasing $5000k print sets and designing MTV award shows, Banksy on the other hand is spending millions of his own money, drawing attention to global issues, provoking thought with street pieces, BOTI and now Dismaland with literally nothing for sale, while entertain millions for free. Hard to even put them in the same category or compare them. As I have said before... There has never been an art figure like him in history and he is doing the exact opposite that most is his position would do. I think many overlook these aspects and the impact these factors will have not only going forward but when future generations look back on his body of work. Gotta fact check. He sold a few things, and is selling a few things. Hes just not flashy. This is why I said "literally" nothing for sale as the very small quantity of nonpublic pieces don't really quality for releases, and for all purposes still makes my point when comparing him to not just Kaws or Koons or any other living artist with anywhere near the level of demand or notoriety.
For me the big difference here is while Koons is selling pieces for the mid eight figures and Kaws is releasing $5000k print sets and designing MTV award shows, Banksy on the other hand is spending millions of his own money, drawing attention to global issues, provoking thought with street pieces, BOTI and now Dismaland with literally nothing for sale, while entertain millions for free. Hard to even put them in the same category or compare them. As I have said before... There has never been an art figure like him in history and he is doing the exact opposite that most is his position would do. I think many overlook these aspects and the impact these factors will have not only going forward but when future generations look back on his body of work. Gotta fact check. He sold a few things, and is selling a few things. Hes just not flashy. This is why I said "literally" nothing for sale as the very small quantity of nonpublic pieces don't really quality for releases, and for all purposes still makes my point when comparing him to not just Kaws or Koons or any other living artist with anywhere near the level of demand or notoriety.
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Kawsisking
New Member
Posts โข 275
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June 2015
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by Kawsisking on Nov 12, 2015 16:22:15 GMT 1, Koons.
Koons.
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nik
New Member
Posts โข 72
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May 2014
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by nik on Nov 13, 2015 0:30:07 GMT 1, Banksy.
Banksy.
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davievegas
New Member
Posts โข 983
Likes โข 355
January 2013
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by davievegas on Nov 13, 2015 0:32:53 GMT 1, Banksy and kaws are more relevant and affordable compared to koons. So I guess it depends on what you can afford and the re-sale value when you need to sell. On that note, I would say kaws and banksy for sure.
Banksy and kaws are more relevant and affordable compared to koons. So I guess it depends on what you can afford and the re-sale value when you need to sell. On that note, I would say kaws and banksy for sure.
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.dappy
Full Member
Posts โข 9,835
Likes โข 9,443
December 2010
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by .dappy on Nov 13, 2015 1:08:37 GMT 1, ... these are just people trying to hit the magic 50+ ... except dvg
don't feed them
... these are just people trying to hit the magic 50+ ... except dvg don't feed them
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nik
New Member
Posts โข 72
Likes โข 44
May 2014
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by nik on Nov 13, 2015 11:29:20 GMT 1, ... these are just people trying to hit the magic 50+ ... except dvg don't feed them
What a popular thing to say to everyone who has under 50 posts in here. Been a member for one and a half years, and followed the forum for at least twice as long. Banksy is my choice over this three (don't own anything from him), just my opinion. An opinion I have because I share the same view as other who have already posted on this thread stated Banksy, so no need for me to repeat (could have said something as "Banksy - because of what Black Apple Art and dss111 had said in this thread".
But If I'm looking away from answering the question originally asked, I would not bought any of those three as an investment my self at this time, but I'm in nowhere the echonomical position either to do so (but IF i was, and IF i where) - my choice is Banksy. That said, I think maddoghoek100 has had some really good posts on this thread.
This forum more and more gives me - as a low post member - the feeling that this forum is a club for the ones who have the most posts, who think all the other people with lower posts are only on the forum to flip. If we don't like meaningless posts on here (who does?), we have to compare it to when there was no 50-post mark for members to sell in here, because as is now I think people will continue with "no-meaning-posts-to-hit-the-magical-50". So either that, or delete the rule. IMHO, I don't think it has been any safer to buy from a member who have "achieved" 50 nonsense posts, than from a member who have been here for a year, with no posts. Would be better with a rule that went on membership length, then posts.
Long post... just had to come out... peace out... and still loving the forum. Nik
... these are just people trying to hit the magic 50+ ... except dvg don't feed them What a popular thing to say to everyone who has under 50 posts in here. Been a member for one and a half years, and followed the forum for at least twice as long. Banksy is my choice over this three (don't own anything from him), just my opinion. An opinion I have because I share the same view as other who have already posted on this thread stated Banksy, so no need for me to repeat (could have said something as "Banksy - because of what Black Apple Art and dss111 had said in this thread". But If I'm looking away from answering the question originally asked, I would not bought any of those three as an investment my self at this time, but I'm in nowhere the echonomical position either to do so (but IF i was, and IF i where) - my choice is Banksy. That said, I think maddoghoek100 has had some really good posts on this thread. This forum more and more gives me - as a low post member - the feeling that this forum is a club for the ones who have the most posts, who think all the other people with lower posts are only on the forum to flip. If we don't like meaningless posts on here (who does?), we have to compare it to when there was no 50-post mark for members to sell in here, because as is now I think people will continue with "no-meaning-posts-to-hit-the-magical-50". So either that, or delete the rule. IMHO, I don't think it has been any safer to buy from a member who have "achieved" 50 nonsense posts, than from a member who have been here for a year, with no posts. Would be better with a rule that went on membership length, then posts. Long post... just had to come out... peace out... and still loving the forum. Nik
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Quinnster
Junior Member
Posts โข 3,624
Likes โข 2,768
January 2006
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by Quinnster on Nov 13, 2015 19:33:06 GMT 1, Just a though but what are they saying on this subject at the KAWS and Koons forum?
Just a though but what are they saying on this subject at the KAWS and Koons forum?
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by Mirus Gallery Poesia on Nov 13, 2015 20:31:55 GMT 1, Not arguing for either, but this question cant really be answered correctly because each are very different and you cant compare banksy to kaws and really cant compare Banksy to Koons due to the fact that each enter the market differently. So investment wise its like comparing stocks to mutual funds to an IPO. There not the same at all even if they all make art. You can compare stocks to stock, or a mutual fund to another fund, but its pointless to compare banksy to koons.
My thought is because Banksy does not actually participate in the market his not really someone you can invest in the same way you can Kaws or Koons. Kaws and Koons still make art that enters the market and is accessible even at outrageous prices its still there to buy, because of this their print work is secondary for collectors who cant afford originals and they produce those from time to time. So there is a supply. There most important pieces enter collections and will enter museums and originals can be compared to pieces that will be collected in museums. You can have a tangible valuation based on these things.
For Banksy he does not enter the market except through older work and backdoor sales to VIP's he is not represented by any galleries and does not enter the market the same way kaws and koons do. Because of this it hinders his collector base with the 1% that gagosian and Mary Boone have in the case of Kaws and Koons. You can argue he has the same connections but knowone really knows and most of it just guessing. So because he does not continue to produce in the same manner as the other 2 artists his market might not be as expansive, regardless of his popularity. I know everyone will argue because of his print sales and popularity there is no where but up. He is not creating new work at the pace that the other are and he is so secretive about what he does produce its tough to gage or compare him to the others. His prints will continue to sell and rise in price I am sure, but what value does that have compared to real originals continued to be sold and entering the market creating new comps. Banksy enters secondary but its almost always old work, its like he is already gone and we are watching an artist who is no longer here. That I feel effects his popularity not with the popular people but with the top collectors who do this for a living. The buyers and collectors who buy and sell million dollar pieces daily. We might call him our hero but with the 1% I am not sure he cracks Koons, and I am not sure Kaws does either even though he does engage in the market.
Not arguing for either, but this question cant really be answered correctly because each are very different and you cant compare banksy to kaws and really cant compare Banksy to Koons due to the fact that each enter the market differently. So investment wise its like comparing stocks to mutual funds to an IPO. There not the same at all even if they all make art. You can compare stocks to stock, or a mutual fund to another fund, but its pointless to compare banksy to koons.
My thought is because Banksy does not actually participate in the market his not really someone you can invest in the same way you can Kaws or Koons. Kaws and Koons still make art that enters the market and is accessible even at outrageous prices its still there to buy, because of this their print work is secondary for collectors who cant afford originals and they produce those from time to time. So there is a supply. There most important pieces enter collections and will enter museums and originals can be compared to pieces that will be collected in museums. You can have a tangible valuation based on these things.
For Banksy he does not enter the market except through older work and backdoor sales to VIP's he is not represented by any galleries and does not enter the market the same way kaws and koons do. Because of this it hinders his collector base with the 1% that gagosian and Mary Boone have in the case of Kaws and Koons. You can argue he has the same connections but knowone really knows and most of it just guessing. So because he does not continue to produce in the same manner as the other 2 artists his market might not be as expansive, regardless of his popularity. I know everyone will argue because of his print sales and popularity there is no where but up. He is not creating new work at the pace that the other are and he is so secretive about what he does produce its tough to gage or compare him to the others. His prints will continue to sell and rise in price I am sure, but what value does that have compared to real originals continued to be sold and entering the market creating new comps. Banksy enters secondary but its almost always old work, its like he is already gone and we are watching an artist who is no longer here. That I feel effects his popularity not with the popular people but with the top collectors who do this for a living. The buyers and collectors who buy and sell million dollar pieces daily. We might call him our hero but with the 1% I am not sure he cracks Koons, and I am not sure Kaws does either even though he does engage in the market.
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ntinla
New Member
Posts โข 51
Likes โข 55
August 2019
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by ntinla on Nov 7, 2019 1:27:02 GMT 1, Interesting to see this old thread. Depending on the image purchased Kaws has probably seen the greatest appreciation in this time span
Interesting to see this old thread. Depending on the image purchased Kaws has probably seen the greatest appreciation in this time span
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jimmyjam
New Member
Posts โข 578
Likes โข 546
October 2019
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ca
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,914
Likes โข 2,372
March 2011
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by ca on Nov 7, 2019 3:35:10 GMT 1, that's actually a great share, should probably have its own thread
that's actually a great share, should probably have its own thread
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cest
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,725
Likes โข 1,160
September 2018
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by cest on Nov 7, 2019 11:38:04 GMT 1, Banksy...he is the British darling and his prints are rushing out of england with the weak pound. It will not be weak forever and the good people of the post uk (or uk) will want thier art back
Banksy...he is the British darling and his prints are rushing out of england with the weak pound. It will not be weak forever and the good people of the post uk (or uk) will want thier art back
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by Slang of Slang on Dec 15, 2019 10:15:31 GMT 1, I will choose mehdi ghadyanloo and hebru Brantley This 2 artist is undervalue For 10 years later I think can sell over 150k us This year hebru done good, many collection sold out , April I bought one 10000us canvas , now around 30000us . For the marketing I think he will promote at black kaws . Daniel arsham I think produce too much product , but can keep value in Asia for coming year
I will choose mehdi ghadyanloo and hebru Brantley This 2 artist is undervalue For 10 years later I think can sell over 150k us This year hebru done good, many collection sold out , April I bought one 10000us canvas , now around 30000us . For the marketing I think he will promote at black kaws . Daniel arsham I think produce too much product , but can keep value in Asia for coming year
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Express Post
Junior Member
Posts โข 3,330
Likes โข 2,479
January 2008
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Better investment Kaws, Koons or Banksy?, by Express Post on Dec 15, 2019 10:29:41 GMT 1, That's impressive for Hebru. Really nice guy. Arsham is a marketing machine. The strategic collaborations with Dior, Disney and Warhol Museum will not hurt his brand. His chairs were low editions of 8, sold out at approximately $70000 each.
I will choose mehdi ghadyanloo and hebru Brantley This 2 artist is undervalue For 10 years later I think can sell over 150k us This year hebru done good, many collection sold out , April I bought one 10000us canvas , now around 30000us . For the marketing I think he will promote at black kaws . Daniel arsham I think produce too much product , but can keep value in Asia for coming year
That's impressive for Hebru. Really nice guy. Arsham is a marketing machine. The strategic collaborations with Dior, Disney and Warhol Museum will not hurt his brand. His chairs were low editions of 8, sold out at approximately $70000 each. I will choose mehdi ghadyanloo and hebru Brantley This 2 artist is undervalue For 10 years later I think can sell over 150k us This year hebru done good, many collection sold out , April I bought one 10000us canvas , now around 30000us . For the marketing I think he will promote at black kaws . Daniel arsham I think produce too much product , but can keep value in Asia for coming year
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