Ermmm, I think you'll find its called marketing. Galleries do it, auction houses do it, even people on this forum do it. I think its quite refreshing that an artist is openly admitting to have a career plan and someone to help him achieve it.
Ultimately, cakes or no cakes, its all about the work. If people don't like the work they won't buy it, no matter how well its marketed. Charming Baker is obviously not everyone's cup of tea, but that doesn't mean he should be slagged off for having the nous to employ professional management. I happen to like a lot of his work (enough to have an original painting on my wall), but it didn't get there because Greenday's manager told me it was cool, it's there because I love it as a piece of art.
It will be interesting to see how Mr Baker's work progresses over the next couple of years. If he keeps moving forward and his work retains its freshness and vitality, then maybe his career will go stratospheric. If it all goes tits-up, then I'll still enjoy my painting, it just won't turn out to be worth as much!
Oh and regarding cakes....whats the difference between that and offering free booze that we all happily guzzle at every other private view? I thought it was rather a nice idea (and clever marketing!!!).
Post by blackcowboy666 on Jun 9, 2009 0:17:54 GMT 1
yes it is marketing, but like two people driving a similar car you get good drivers and you get bad drivers...you get people like Elms Lester who are genuinely passionate about their artworld, the artists they work with and the future career of the artists for the right reasons (creating legendary artists, lasting works and legacies etc)...they market the art because not only do they have overheads and want to make a profit (it is a business after all)...but they are genuine in believing in their artists and building their artists reputation...and then I compare it to that big american corporate music manager douche bag (no artworld experiance or passion shown...) who seems only interested in Charming Baker to 'make it work'...which i presume means cashing in on the urban art market and the high prices seen at Banksy auctions...even with Laz he always believes and publically states his passion for an artist...but this douche bag simply comes across as some guy who woke up, read a newspaper in 2009 about last years art prices...said 'i want those returns in my bank account...im off to London [cut to speeded up Aeroplane shot a la 'Snatch]' and he's in London looking for any artist who might sell. What i say or think doesnt really account for much at the end of it...and they dont care and i dont...but to me all of this Charming Baker BS is about as contemporary, interesting, fresh or vital as the next Keane record...its all so pedestrian, safe, boring and without the boardroom backing he would be anonymous forever...and to be honest i dont give him long...this greenday backer will get bored in a year, and galleries and most collectors wont be interested in him after he has slept with the coporate devil...he has a nice house so im sure he's not worried (charming baker that is)...
im sorry, everyone is allowed their opinions and i completly respect you and yours (honest!) but Charming Baker is definetly not Fresh and Vital...you can say beautiful, interesting, nice...if you were inclined...but his work is not fresh - i have seen dozens like it at many a end of year show for many a year, his style is not new or important...its boring and uninspired...and his work is not vital, it is not adding or contributing anything new to this world, has no energy or of critical importance...
Sadly i think nowadays the old argument of people not buying pieces because they dont like it is false...i, probably like you, only buy pieces because we love them...but its a very real current situation where naive art buyers buy whatever they perceive as 'hot' or that will be the 'next Banksy'....
I think with Charming Baker it will be 50/50...either there are other people out there who are disgusted by this corporate sell out backing team or others who genuinly love his work...either way, good luck to the artist
the cakes...each to their own. I personally find it very very bland and too middle class and 'safe'...i dont want openings full of paint fumes with some Vice magazine model doing K off a homeless guy or faux street edge...hell no...but it was just a bit too 'parents evening' for me..."come and see daddys / my husbands exhibition in hip and funky old street...hes an urban artist dont you know?...yes we have some cake after your drive up..."
but fair play to him trying to make his name, shame he picked a bad horse to back, but you cant blame him for trying to get that £££...and i do wish him the best...also, i respect anyone creating and following their dreams - weather i like it or not thats not the point...
Now now children, play nicely or we'll have to take your art away and you won't get it back until after dinner!
Seriously though, the two previous posts prove my point....its all about the art. Managers or no managers, cake or no cake, if people don't like the art, it won't get bought. We all have different tastes, that's what makes the discussions on these forums so lively. I like Charming Baker, you don't. Nothing wrong with that.
I can sort of see why doing an interview on the Beeb about having a rock-star manager might get up some people's noses, maybe allowing us a glimpse 'behind the curtain' might prove to be a mistake. We'll find out over the next year or so. Mind you, can't wait to get Charming Baker's greatest hits when it comes out (i-tunes only I hear)
Post by blackcowboy666 on Jun 10, 2009 13:02:08 GMT 1
dear Tuftynuts this is a forum, a (theoretically) open forum for all ideas and opinions, because after all, all ideas and opinion are equal and should be heard...so my 'rants' are as valid as the posts praising Charming Baker. If everyone was a sycophant then the world would be well & truly stuffed. I am glad that me as a newcomer, someone with a whopping 30+ posts is picked up on my newbie status by such a verteran of the board as yourself- someone with 12 posts...really glad i joined now!
I do want an artist to be looked after by a gallery. Of course i do - its often best for the artists. Give me someone genuinely interested in the artists art and the artist themselves, for the reasons of love of the art, the desire to further and aide an artists long term career over someone who wants to ride the bandwagon and milk the urban cash cow without adding anything. Give me care and passion for art over a money hungry douche anytime...does this make me wrong? If you read my 'rants' you will see yes i dont like Charming Bakers work, but i am more irate about the management - Greendays corporate american rock management team (again, this is fact, and reads like a joke)..if Greenday,its management and record company - Warner Bros are not the epitome of large scale boardroom corporate american entertainment industry then you are mistaken (do you work in the music industry?)
For me a good or great artist is someone with a unique voice, someone who might bring something new to the world - a new technique or voice...from Pollack to Banksy, Fairey to Warhol...and i look at Charming Baker and i think 'i have this kind of work a dozen times before...and often better...what is he saying? how is it emotionally or intellectually interesting? is its techniques good?'...
as said in my previous posts...i respect anyone who likes him, i do...each to their own...i am just shocked by his manager and lack of art passion and to me it is a scary thing to come to the artworld. As soon as you enter the public domain - in a gallery or on a forum, you are putting it out for the whole world to see, and form their own opinions..and they are not always universally positive...too many people forget this.
as for my knowledge on other careers, i am hiding behind this login name (as is most people), but i do know a fair bit art and the artworld...and even if i didn't i am still allowed my comments and thoughts...after all this is a forum...not everyone loves everything you know...
Still I went down soaked it up - had a laugh - saw what was going on and thought this is "slightly not what I expected" / "understated" ... slightly better than the SG show (without the pandas unfort).
From what I hear the interpretation of GD management involvement is slightly overblown and misinterpretted but then "in" the art world - if there is such a place - this is often the case. ( / modus operandi)
If you get the chance check it out.... (though the tubes might impede your travel today / thur..)
Charming Baker has been asked to participate in Amnesty International's Blank Canvas project alongside Tracy Emin, The Chapman Brothers, Sarah Lucas and Sir Peter Blake. More information here: www.blankcanvasproject.org/Artists.html
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