alandavies
New Member
Posts โข 71
Likes โข 68
August 2019
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by alandavies on Sept 16, 2019 20:57:23 GMT 1, For those feeling let down by CE atm...
This is the greatest post ever ๐๐
For those feeling let down by CE atm... This is the greatest post ever ๐๐
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Poster Bob
Junior Member
Posts โข 5,802
Likes โข 5,417
September 2013
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by Poster Bob on Sept 16, 2019 20:58:37 GMT 1, There is still some profit to be had on the Miller, but it is really only worthwhile if you're one of the first to purchase, outside of the EU and quick enough to apply the discount code. Even then I can't see you making more than 20-25% profit after auction fees are considered.
Tiered releases can be hard to flip. Their tiered nature makes them far less likely to sell out, leaving stragglers around that create a price ceiling. If it doesn't sell out it has essentially been burned and is perceived as less desirable. In order to sell yours you need to offer a worthwhile discount from the cost at source, as does every other seller, causing competition and further preventing the edition from selling out.
Maybe when you kids are older you'll live that VIP life and eat first like Bob does.
There is still some profit to be had on the Miller, but it is really only worthwhile if you're one of the first to purchase, outside of the EU and quick enough to apply the discount code. Even then I can't see you making more than 20-25% profit after auction fees are considered.
Tiered releases can be hard to flip. Their tiered nature makes them far less likely to sell out, leaving stragglers around that create a price ceiling. If it doesn't sell out it has essentially been burned and is perceived as less desirable. In order to sell yours you need to offer a worthwhile discount from the cost at source, as does every other seller, causing competition and further preventing the edition from selling out.
Maybe when you kids are older you'll live that VIP life and eat first like Bob does.
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trapnel1
New Member
Posts โข 652
Likes โข 457
September 2008
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by trapnel1 on Sept 16, 2019 21:01:10 GMT 1, I've purchased from CE a few times over the years, and have always found them excellent to deal with. Quality and packaging of their prints is second to none. There are advantages and disadvantages of a tiered pricing model, but that is their standard approach and it seems to work well for them. Almost all galleries give preference to regular clients, which is why building a relationship with a gallery is important rather than expecting to be able to dip in and easily purchase for the first time when there is heavy demand. And if it's not possible on this occasion because demand exceeds supply, there will always be more art to buy soon....
I've purchased from CE a few times over the years, and have always found them excellent to deal with. Quality and packaging of their prints is second to none. There are advantages and disadvantages of a tiered pricing model, but that is their standard approach and it seems to work well for them. Almost all galleries give preference to regular clients, which is why building a relationship with a gallery is important rather than expecting to be able to dip in and easily purchase for the first time when there is heavy demand. And if it's not possible on this occasion because demand exceeds supply, there will always be more art to buy soon....
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cnrdvln
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,401
Likes โข 1,487
February 2017
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by cnrdvln on Sept 16, 2019 22:27:20 GMT 1,
If anyone has the funds, forget the print and get a massive original
If anyone has the funds, forget the print and get a massive original
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ca
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,915
Likes โข 2,372
March 2011
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by ca on Sept 17, 2019 4:19:32 GMT 1, ahaha so many people convincing themselves to like that fugly pensato print, amazing
ahaha so many people convincing themselves to like that fugly pensato print, amazing
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19818914
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,337
Likes โข 1,029
October 2018
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by 19818914 on Sept 17, 2019 5:35:43 GMT 1, ahaha so many people convincing themselves to like that fugly pensato print, amazing
The bronze she did was phenomenal. This print looks unfinished. For reference thereโs a scarf on paddle 8 that really outshines this print. paddle8.com/work/joyce-pensato/180568-dark-knight-forever/
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Pavoni
Artist
New Member
Posts โข 460
Likes โข 541
September 2013
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by Pavoni on Sept 17, 2019 5:37:21 GMT 1, To my eye, none of those prints are near best examples of work by any of those artists.*
Shrigley constantly posting drawings on IG, some are great, funny, well-crafted (the Kierkegaard Life Backwards/Forwards tunnel drawing, e.g.), all of them far outclass that stupid heart / Pets thing.
Note: not talking about ability to wring profit from early purchases, just merit of images themselves.
* K Bernhardt comes close as it has a Pink Panther, but that's not saying much is it.
To my eye, none of those prints are near best examples of work by any of those artists.*
Shrigley constantly posting drawings on IG, some are great, funny, well-crafted (the Kierkegaard Life Backwards/Forwards tunnel drawing, e.g.), all of them far outclass that stupid heart / Pets thing.
Note: not talking about ability to wring profit from early purchases, just merit of images themselves.
* K Bernhardt comes close as it has a Pink Panther, but that's not saying much is it.
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whob1
New Member
Posts โข 154
Likes โข 145
October 2016
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by whob1 on Sept 17, 2019 6:43:21 GMT 1, ahaha so many people convincing themselves to like that fugly pensato print, amazing Doesnt matter, maybe she is "new" for many members in here, then "convincing" is quite natural. People have loved her art for many years. For any art collector it should be an honour to own a signed piece from her.
ahaha so many people convincing themselves to like that fugly pensato print, amazing Doesnt matter, maybe she is "new" for many members in here, then "convincing" is quite natural. People have loved her art for many years. For any art collector it should be an honour to own a signed piece from her.
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alandavies
New Member
Posts โข 71
Likes โข 68
August 2019
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by alandavies on Sept 17, 2019 7:19:28 GMT 1, ahaha so many people convincing themselves to like that fugly pensato print, amazing Doesnt matter, maybe she is "new" for manyย membersย in here, then "convincing" is quite natural.ย People have loved her art for many years. For any art collector it should be an honour to own a signed piece from her.
So the physical art has no relevance? We are simply collecting autographs?
This is a very poor example of a pensato..
ahaha so many people convincing themselves to like that fugly pensato print, amazing Doesnt matter, maybe she is "new" for manyย membersย in here, then "convincing" is quite natural.ย People have loved her art for many years. For any art collector it should be an honour to own a signed piece from her. So the physical art has no relevance? We are simply collecting autographs? This is a very poor example of a pensato..
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whob1
New Member
Posts โข 154
Likes โข 145
October 2016
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by whob1 on Sept 17, 2019 7:39:35 GMT 1, Doesnt matter, maybe she is "new" for many members in here, then "convincing" is quite natural. People have loved her art for many years. For any art collector it should be an honour to own a signed piece from her. So the physical art has no relevance? We are simply collecting autographs? This is a very poor example of a pensato.. Of course it has, buy only if you like it, that does not rule out it being an honour. I didnt write anything else, you prob know that and the answer to you own questions.
I disagree.
Doesnt matter, maybe she is "new" for many members in here, then "convincing" is quite natural. People have loved her art for many years. For any art collector it should be an honour to own a signed piece from her. So the physical art has no relevance? We are simply collecting autographs? This is a very poor example of a pensato.. Of course it has, buy only if you like it, that does not rule out it being an honour. I didnt write anything else, you prob know that and the answer to you own questions.
I disagree.
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witchdoctor
New Member
Posts โข 269
Likes โข 203
January 2018
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by witchdoctor on Sept 17, 2019 9:56:11 GMT 1, So let me get this clear, these prints are to celebrate 100 Years of Save The Children, but only one third of the profits will be donated to Save The Children? So does it cost ยฃ10K to produce the Harland Miller High on Hope print? Also does the cost to produce any print increase incrementally, hence why the pricing is tiered? You all argue about the flippability of the prints, but no one seems to be questioning the motive of an organisation that clearly has no interest in the charity, but is only motivated by greed. Shame on you all that promote or endorse this kind of behaviour. Remember this is done all under the pretext that it is for charity. Well. 1/3 out of 18k is more than 1/3 out of 8000k. So they increase the charity-proportion of this and it should be of interest also for the organisation to sell the prints as close up to secondary marked value as possible
So let me get this clear, these prints are to celebrate 100 Years of Save The Children, but only one third of the profits will be donated to Save The Children? So does it cost ยฃ10K to produce the Harland Miller High on Hope print? Also does the cost to produce any print increase incrementally, hence why the pricing is tiered? You all argue about the flippability of the prints, but no one seems to be questioning the motive of an organisation that clearly has no interest in the charity, but is only motivated by greed. Shame on you all that promote or endorse this kind of behaviour. Remember this is done all under the pretext that it is for charity. Well. 1/3 out of 18k is more than 1/3 out of 8000k. So they increase the charity-proportion of this and it should be of interest also for the organisation to sell the prints as close up to secondary marked value as possible
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by Coach on Sept 17, 2019 9:58:36 GMT 1, So let me get this clear, these prints are to celebrate 100 Years of Save The Children, but only one third of the profits will be donated to Save The Children? So does it cost ยฃ10K to produce the Harland Miller High on Hope print? Also does the cost to produce any print increase incrementally, hence why the pricing is tiered? You all argue about the flippability of the prints, but no one seems to be questioning the motive of an organisation that clearly has no interest in the charity, but is only motivated by greed. Shame on you all that promote or endorse this kind of behaviour. Remember this is done all under the pretext that it is for charity.
Shame on you is rather a strong phrase. Is it not better that a third of profits go to charity than nothing? Are you suggesting that they are using a charity connection to increase sales? I canโt see why they would need to in view of the calibre of the artists involved.
So let me get this clear, these prints are to celebrate 100 Years of Save The Children, but only one third of the profits will be donated to Save The Children? So does it cost ยฃ10K to produce the Harland Miller High on Hope print? Also does the cost to produce any print increase incrementally, hence why the pricing is tiered? You all argue about the flippability of the prints, but no one seems to be questioning the motive of an organisation that clearly has no interest in the charity, but is only motivated by greed. Shame on you all that promote or endorse this kind of behaviour. Remember this is done all under the pretext that it is for charity. Shame on you is rather a strong phrase. Is it not better that a third of profits go to charity than nothing? Are you suggesting that they are using a charity connection to increase sales? I canโt see why they would need to in view of the calibre of the artists involved.
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nex
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,573
Likes โข 1,819
February 2009
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by nex on Sept 17, 2019 9:59:40 GMT 1, So let me get this clear, these prints are to celebrate 100 Years of Save The Children, but only one third of the profits will be donated to Save The Children? So does it cost ยฃ10K to produce the Harland Miller High on Hope print? Also does the cost to produce any print increase incrementally, hence why the pricing is tiered? You all argue about the flippability of the prints, but no one seems to be questioning the motive of an organisation that clearly has no interest in the charity, but is only motivated by greed. Shame on you all that promote or endorse this kind of behaviour. Remember this is done all under the pretext that it is for charity. [br
Tiering is common practice in galleries ๐คท๐ปโโ๏ธ
I agree itโs to my mind pretty murky territory but there you go / itโs the world weโre in
So let me get this clear, these prints are to celebrate 100 Years of Save The Children, but only one third of the profits will be donated to Save The Children? So does it cost ยฃ10K to produce the Harland Miller High on Hope print? Also does the cost to produce any print increase incrementally, hence why the pricing is tiered? You all argue about the flippability of the prints, but no one seems to be questioning the motive of an organisation that clearly has no interest in the charity, but is only motivated by greed. Shame on you all that promote or endorse this kind of behaviour. Remember this is done all under the pretext that it is for charity. [br Tiering is common practice in galleries ๐คท๐ปโโ๏ธ I agree itโs to my mind pretty murky territory but there you go / itโs the world weโre in
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by Coach on Sept 17, 2019 10:03:04 GMT 1, So let me get this clear, these prints are to celebrate 100 Years of Save The Children, but only one third of the profits will be donated to Save The Children? So does it cost ยฃ10K to produce the Harland Miller High on Hope print? Also does the cost to produce any print increase incrementally, hence why the pricing is tiered? You all argue about the flippability of the prints, but no one seems to be questioning the motive of an organisation that clearly has no interest in the charity, but is only motivated by greed. Shame on you all that promote or endorse this kind of behaviour. Remember this is done all under the pretext that it is for charity. [br Tiering is common practice in galleries ๐คท๐ปโโ๏ธ I agree itโs to my mind pretty murky territory but there you go / itโs the world weโre in
Very true. Itโs unpleasant, as it puts a buyer under pressure, and these days the lower tiers seem rarely to be available for the average buyer, which can leave a buyer paying a higher tier feeling aggrieved. But thatโs the way itโs commonly done, and no one forces anyone to buy.
So let me get this clear, these prints are to celebrate 100 Years of Save The Children, but only one third of the profits will be donated to Save The Children? So does it cost ยฃ10K to produce the Harland Miller High on Hope print? Also does the cost to produce any print increase incrementally, hence why the pricing is tiered? You all argue about the flippability of the prints, but no one seems to be questioning the motive of an organisation that clearly has no interest in the charity, but is only motivated by greed. Shame on you all that promote or endorse this kind of behaviour. Remember this is done all under the pretext that it is for charity. [br Tiering is common practice in galleries ๐คท๐ปโโ๏ธ I agree itโs to my mind pretty murky territory but there you go / itโs the world weโre in Very true. Itโs unpleasant, as it puts a buyer under pressure, and these days the lower tiers seem rarely to be available for the average buyer, which can leave a buyer paying a higher tier feeling aggrieved. But thatโs the way itโs commonly done, and no one forces anyone to buy.
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kfroms
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,684
Likes โข 2,539
October 2011
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by kfroms on Sept 17, 2019 10:12:19 GMT 1, Like most, I hate tiered pricing as well but get the point of it. That said CE ( and all the others who do it ) should at least announce the tiers / prices hikes upfront - that would take lots of the dodgyness away.
Like most, I hate tiered pricing as well but get the point of it. That said CE ( and all the others who do it ) should at least announce the tiers / prices hikes upfront - that would take lots of the dodgyness away.
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by Horatio Nelson on Sept 17, 2019 10:20:42 GMT 1, **advance warning of slight rant**
First up, I have bought from CE before and think theyโre great in many respects. I get the points about "only" a third of the profits going to Save the Children, but to that I would say that (i) any effort to raise money, whatever the proportion of sales/profit, is laudable and (ii) Counter still have a new premises, staff etc etc to pay for. A third of profit on 75 portfolios (plus some other prints) at ยฃ20-30k each is still going to approach something like ยฃ500k.
Personally, Iโm very much in two minds about the Emin print (and a lot of the thoughts that follow could be said about all the works offered in the portfolio and CE more generally).
The starting point is that I'm a collector of Tracey's work with a natural tendency to buy her releases, and this is a decent print. I haven't yet decided whether the reclining woman figure is getting a bit repetitive, or whether it is actually becoming something of a trademark motif with a number of successful variations (including the last counter release).
Anyway... I am really hesitating on buying from Counter Editions on this occasion (as I did for the recent "No Surrender" release). The whole process is so off-market and atypical of how the artists would usually sell their work through other channels that it makes me slightly uncomfortable as a genuine collector, and I find myself considering the purchase for the wrong reasons.
Virtually all other galleries making a offering a new release will offer Traceyโ editions (even in lower edition numbers) at a reasonable price that is generally fixed over the life of the edition, which still take weeks or months (or longer) to sell out. For example, White Cube has recently offered a few editions limited to 50 (admittedly 20-30% smaller in paper/image size), at a not dissimilar price to what CE are offering tier one of this print at. I have been in touch multiple times with White Cube to discuss those works, view them in the shop and the price hasn't changed in all that time as far as I'm aware. Yes, the editions do eventually sell out, but there is at least a chance to have a meaningful reflection on whether it's something to add to the collection.
I suppose what Iโm trying to say is that if this print were being released through White Cube (or any other gallery) and was not tiered, would I rush to get it? Knowing that this is an edition of 200, I certainly wouldnโt rush. Iโd at least take a trip down to the gallery to see it in the flesh, if possible. But with Counter Editions, you HAVE to rush if you want it (or even if youโre only 60% sure you like the piece and donโt want to live with the regret/cost of missing out at an early stage). The ยฃ1,625 (or ยฃ1,300 with inevitable 20% discount) is a fair price for a Tracey Emin of this size and subject matter, but I hate feeling rushed into buying it. Also, I happen to have a meeting at work today that goes on until 2pm - I don't want to be getting out my iphone and credit card at 2:00:01 just to make sure that I'm paying the right price for an artwork.
I donโt buy to resell or flip (everything I own gets framed and goes up on the wall), but I still struggle with buying at 150-300% times launch price when I had the opportunity to buy at launch. So really, Iโve concluded that Counter Editions, as great as it is, thrives mostly on (i) genuine collectorsโ FOMO, rather than a pure desire to own any particular piece and (ii) creating opportunity for flippers. Neither of which are a great reason for buying a work of art priced at four figures (or higher). The fact that I'm not a flipper doesn't make the inevitable price increases a particularly desirable reason to buy either - for instance, I bought one of the Hodgkin prints which has since increase by nearly 3x what I paid, but it's still on the wall giving me the same (not 3x) the amount of pleasure it did when I got it back from the framers. This wasnโt intended to be a moan about Counter Editions (and letโs not forget that this portfolio is a great project that benefits charity).
On reflection, I think Iโm likely to give this release a miss and take the time to find another work by Tracey that I really really really want. E.g. one of the Grand Hotels, or something from an edition of 50. Maybe I'll regret passing up this opportunity, but on this occasion I think my buying decision has to be with the head rather than the heart.
**advance warning of slight rant**
First up, I have bought from CE before and think theyโre great in many respects. I get the points about "only" a third of the profits going to Save the Children, but to that I would say that (i) any effort to raise money, whatever the proportion of sales/profit, is laudable and (ii) Counter still have a new premises, staff etc etc to pay for. A third of profit on 75 portfolios (plus some other prints) at ยฃ20-30k each is still going to approach something like ยฃ500k.
Personally, Iโm very much in two minds about the Emin print (and a lot of the thoughts that follow could be said about all the works offered in the portfolio and CE more generally).
The starting point is that I'm a collector of Tracey's work with a natural tendency to buy her releases, and this is a decent print. I haven't yet decided whether the reclining woman figure is getting a bit repetitive, or whether it is actually becoming something of a trademark motif with a number of successful variations (including the last counter release).
Anyway... I am really hesitating on buying from Counter Editions on this occasion (as I did for the recent "No Surrender" release). The whole process is so off-market and atypical of how the artists would usually sell their work through other channels that it makes me slightly uncomfortable as a genuine collector, and I find myself considering the purchase for the wrong reasons.
Virtually all other galleries making a offering a new release will offer Traceyโ editions (even in lower edition numbers) at a reasonable price that is generally fixed over the life of the edition, which still take weeks or months (or longer) to sell out. For example, White Cube has recently offered a few editions limited to 50 (admittedly 20-30% smaller in paper/image size), at a not dissimilar price to what CE are offering tier one of this print at. I have been in touch multiple times with White Cube to discuss those works, view them in the shop and the price hasn't changed in all that time as far as I'm aware. Yes, the editions do eventually sell out, but there is at least a chance to have a meaningful reflection on whether it's something to add to the collection.
I suppose what Iโm trying to say is that if this print were being released through White Cube (or any other gallery) and was not tiered, would I rush to get it? Knowing that this is an edition of 200, I certainly wouldnโt rush. Iโd at least take a trip down to the gallery to see it in the flesh, if possible. But with Counter Editions, you HAVE to rush if you want it (or even if youโre only 60% sure you like the piece and donโt want to live with the regret/cost of missing out at an early stage). The ยฃ1,625 (or ยฃ1,300 with inevitable 20% discount) is a fair price for a Tracey Emin of this size and subject matter, but I hate feeling rushed into buying it. Also, I happen to have a meeting at work today that goes on until 2pm - I don't want to be getting out my iphone and credit card at 2:00:01 just to make sure that I'm paying the right price for an artwork.
I donโt buy to resell or flip (everything I own gets framed and goes up on the wall), but I still struggle with buying at 150-300% times launch price when I had the opportunity to buy at launch. So really, Iโve concluded that Counter Editions, as great as it is, thrives mostly on (i) genuine collectorsโ FOMO, rather than a pure desire to own any particular piece and (ii) creating opportunity for flippers. Neither of which are a great reason for buying a work of art priced at four figures (or higher). The fact that I'm not a flipper doesn't make the inevitable price increases a particularly desirable reason to buy either - for instance, I bought one of the Hodgkin prints which has since increase by nearly 3x what I paid, but it's still on the wall giving me the same (not 3x) the amount of pleasure it did when I got it back from the framers. This wasnโt intended to be a moan about Counter Editions (and letโs not forget that this portfolio is a great project that benefits charity).
On reflection, I think Iโm likely to give this release a miss and take the time to find another work by Tracey that I really really really want. E.g. one of the Grand Hotels, or something from an edition of 50. Maybe I'll regret passing up this opportunity, but on this occasion I think my buying decision has to be with the head rather than the heart.
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blerd
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,345
Likes โข 1,195
November 2016
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by blerd on Sept 17, 2019 10:30:04 GMT 1, **advance warning of slight rant** First up, I have bought from CE before and think theyโre great in many respects. I get the points about "only" a third of the profits going to Save the Children, but to that I would say that (i) any effort to raise money, whatever the proportion of sales/profit, is laudable and (ii) Counter still have a new premises, staff etc etc to pay for. A third of profit on 75 portfolios (plus some other prints) at ยฃ20-30k each is still going to approach something like ยฃ500k. Personally, Iโm very much in two minds about the Emin print (and a lot of the thoughts that follow could be said about all the works offered in the portfolio and CE more generally). The starting point is that I'm a collector of Tracey's work with a natural tendency to buy her releases, and this is a decent print. I haven't yet decided whether the reclining woman figure is getting a bit repetitive, or whether it is actually becoming something of a trademark motif with a number of successful variations (including the last counter release). Anyway... I am really hesitating on buying from Counter Editions on this occasion (as I did for the recent "No Surrender" release). The whole process is so off-market and atypical of how the artists would usually sell their work through other channels that it makes me slightly uncomfortable as a genuine collector, and I find myself considering the purchase for the wrong reasons. Virtually all other galleries making a offering a new release will offer Traceyโ editions (even in lower edition numbers) at a reasonable price that is generally fixed over the life of the edition, which still take weeks or months (or longer) to sell out. For example, White Cube has recently offered a few editions limited to 50 (admittedly 20-30% smaller in paper/image size), at a not dissimilar price to what CE are offering tier one of this print at. I have been in touch multiple times with White Cube to discuss those works, view them in the shop and the price hasn't changed in all that time as far as I'm aware. Yes, the editions do eventually sell out, but there is at least a chance to have a meaningful reflection on whether it's something to add to the collection. I suppose what Iโm trying to say is that if this print were being released through White Cube (or any other gallery) and was not tiered, would I rush to get it? Knowing that this is an edition of 200, I certainly wouldnโt rush. Iโd at least take a trip down to the gallery to see it in the flesh, if possible. But with Counter Editions, you HAVE to rush if you want it (or even if youโre only 60% sure you like the piece and donโt want to live with the regret/cost of missing out at an early stage). The ยฃ1,625 (or ยฃ1,300 with inevitable 20% discount) is a fair price for a Tracey Emin of this size and subject matter, but I hate feeling rushed into buying it. Also, I happen to have a meeting at work today that goes on until 2pm - I don't want to be getting out my iphone and credit card at 2:00:01 just to make sure that I'm paying the right price for an artwork. I donโt buy to resell or flip (everything I own gets framed and goes up on the wall), but I still struggle with buying at 150-300% times launch price when I had the opportunity to buy at launch. So really, Iโve concluded that Counter Editions, as great as it is, thrives mostly on (i) genuine collectorsโ FOMO, rather than a pure desire to own any particular piece and (ii) creating opportunity for flippers. Neither of which are a great reason for buying a work of art priced at four figures (or higher). The fact that I'm not a flipper doesn't make the inevitable price increases a particularly desirable reason to buy either - for instance, I bought one of the Hodgkin prints which has since increase by nearly 3x what I paid, but it's still on the wall giving me the same (not 3x) the amount of pleasure it did when I got it back from the framers. This wasnโt intended to be a moan about Counter Editions (and letโs not forget that this portfolio is a great project that benefits charity). On reflection, I think Iโm likely to give this release a miss and take the time to find another work by Tracey that I really really really want. E.g. one of the Grand Hotels, or something from an edition of 50. Maybe I'll regret passing up this opportunity, but on this occasion I think my buying decision has to be with the head rather than the heart. Did you get the Emin bronze from White cube. Edition of 50, 2.5k signed and numbered. A steal IMO.
**advance warning of slight rant** First up, I have bought from CE before and think theyโre great in many respects. I get the points about "only" a third of the profits going to Save the Children, but to that I would say that (i) any effort to raise money, whatever the proportion of sales/profit, is laudable and (ii) Counter still have a new premises, staff etc etc to pay for. A third of profit on 75 portfolios (plus some other prints) at ยฃ20-30k each is still going to approach something like ยฃ500k. Personally, Iโm very much in two minds about the Emin print (and a lot of the thoughts that follow could be said about all the works offered in the portfolio and CE more generally). The starting point is that I'm a collector of Tracey's work with a natural tendency to buy her releases, and this is a decent print. I haven't yet decided whether the reclining woman figure is getting a bit repetitive, or whether it is actually becoming something of a trademark motif with a number of successful variations (including the last counter release). Anyway... I am really hesitating on buying from Counter Editions on this occasion (as I did for the recent "No Surrender" release). The whole process is so off-market and atypical of how the artists would usually sell their work through other channels that it makes me slightly uncomfortable as a genuine collector, and I find myself considering the purchase for the wrong reasons. Virtually all other galleries making a offering a new release will offer Traceyโ editions (even in lower edition numbers) at a reasonable price that is generally fixed over the life of the edition, which still take weeks or months (or longer) to sell out. For example, White Cube has recently offered a few editions limited to 50 (admittedly 20-30% smaller in paper/image size), at a not dissimilar price to what CE are offering tier one of this print at. I have been in touch multiple times with White Cube to discuss those works, view them in the shop and the price hasn't changed in all that time as far as I'm aware. Yes, the editions do eventually sell out, but there is at least a chance to have a meaningful reflection on whether it's something to add to the collection. I suppose what Iโm trying to say is that if this print were being released through White Cube (or any other gallery) and was not tiered, would I rush to get it? Knowing that this is an edition of 200, I certainly wouldnโt rush. Iโd at least take a trip down to the gallery to see it in the flesh, if possible. But with Counter Editions, you HAVE to rush if you want it (or even if youโre only 60% sure you like the piece and donโt want to live with the regret/cost of missing out at an early stage). The ยฃ1,625 (or ยฃ1,300 with inevitable 20% discount) is a fair price for a Tracey Emin of this size and subject matter, but I hate feeling rushed into buying it. Also, I happen to have a meeting at work today that goes on until 2pm - I don't want to be getting out my iphone and credit card at 2:00:01 just to make sure that I'm paying the right price for an artwork. I donโt buy to resell or flip (everything I own gets framed and goes up on the wall), but I still struggle with buying at 150-300% times launch price when I had the opportunity to buy at launch. So really, Iโve concluded that Counter Editions, as great as it is, thrives mostly on (i) genuine collectorsโ FOMO, rather than a pure desire to own any particular piece and (ii) creating opportunity for flippers. Neither of which are a great reason for buying a work of art priced at four figures (or higher). The fact that I'm not a flipper doesn't make the inevitable price increases a particularly desirable reason to buy either - for instance, I bought one of the Hodgkin prints which has since increase by nearly 3x what I paid, but it's still on the wall giving me the same (not 3x) the amount of pleasure it did when I got it back from the framers. This wasnโt intended to be a moan about Counter Editions (and letโs not forget that this portfolio is a great project that benefits charity). On reflection, I think Iโm likely to give this release a miss and take the time to find another work by Tracey that I really really really want. E.g. one of the Grand Hotels, or something from an edition of 50. Maybe I'll regret passing up this opportunity, but on this occasion I think my buying decision has to be with the head rather than the heart. Did you get the Emin bronze from White cube. Edition of 50, 2.5k signed and numbered. A steal IMO.
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cnrdvln
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,401
Likes โข 1,487
February 2017
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by cnrdvln on Sept 17, 2019 10:53:58 GMT 1, **advance warning of slight rant** First up, I have bought from CE before and think theyโre great in many respects. I get the points about "only" a third of the profits going to Save the Children, but to that I would say that (i) any effort to raise money, whatever the proportion of sales/profit, is laudable and (ii) Counter still have a new premises, staff etc etc to pay for. A third of profit on 75 portfolios (plus some other prints) at ยฃ20-30k each is still going to approach something like ยฃ500k. Personally, Iโm very much in two minds about the Emin print (and a lot of the thoughts that follow could be said about all the works offered in the portfolio and CE more generally). The starting point is that I'm a collector of Tracey's work with a natural tendency to buy her releases, and this is a decent print. I haven't yet decided whether the reclining woman figure is getting a bit repetitive, or whether it is actually becoming something of a trademark motif with a number of successful variations (including the last counter release). Anyway... I am really hesitating on buying from Counter Editions on this occasion (as I did for the recent "No Surrender" release). The whole process is so off-market and atypical of how the artists would usually sell their work through other channels that it makes me slightly uncomfortable as a genuine collector, and I find myself considering the purchase for the wrong reasons. Virtually all other galleries making a offering a new release will offer Traceyโ editions (even in lower edition numbers) at a reasonable price that is generally fixed over the life of the edition, which still take weeks or months (or longer) to sell out. For example, White Cube has recently offered a few editions limited to 50 (admittedly 20-30% smaller in paper/image size), at a not dissimilar price to what CE are offering tier one of this print at. I have been in touch multiple times with White Cube to discuss those works, view them in the shop and the price hasn't changed in all that time as far as I'm aware. Yes, the editions do eventually sell out, but there is at least a chance to have a meaningful reflection on whether it's something to add to the collection. I suppose what Iโm trying to say is that if this print were being released through White Cube (or any other gallery) and was not tiered, would I rush to get it? Knowing that this is an edition of 200, I certainly wouldnโt rush. Iโd at least take a trip down to the gallery to see it in the flesh, if possible. But with Counter Editions, you HAVE to rush if you want it (or even if youโre only 60% sure you like the piece and donโt want to live with the regret/cost of missing out at an early stage). The ยฃ1,625 (or ยฃ1,300 with inevitable 20% discount) is a fair price for a Tracey Emin of this size and subject matter, but I hate feeling rushed into buying it. Also, I happen to have a meeting at work today that goes on until 2pm - I don't want to be getting out my iphone and credit card at 2:00:01 just to make sure that I'm paying the right price for an artwork. I donโt buy to resell or flip (everything I own gets framed and goes up on the wall), but I still struggle with buying at 150-300% times launch price when I had the opportunity to buy at launch. So really, Iโve concluded that Counter Editions, as great as it is, thrives mostly on (i) genuine collectorsโ FOMO, rather than a pure desire to own any particular piece and (ii) creating opportunity for flippers. Neither of which are a great reason for buying a work of art priced at four figures (or higher). The fact that I'm not a flipper doesn't make the inevitable price increases a particularly desirable reason to buy either - for instance, I bought one of the Hodgkin prints which has since increase by nearly 3x what I paid, but it's still on the wall giving me the same (not 3x) the amount of pleasure it did when I got it back from the framers. This wasnโt intended to be a moan about Counter Editions (and letโs not forget that this portfolio is a great project that benefits charity). On reflection, I think Iโm likely to give this release a miss and take the time to find another work by Tracey that I really really really want. E.g. one of the Grand Hotels, or something from an edition of 50. Maybe I'll regret passing up this opportunity, but on this occasion I think my buying decision has to be with the head rather than the heart. Did you get the Emin bronze from White cube. Edition of 50, 2.5k signed and numbered. A steal IMO. Is there a massive version of this going to a Polish Museum? I head something about that but not sure of same piece
**advance warning of slight rant** First up, I have bought from CE before and think theyโre great in many respects. I get the points about "only" a third of the profits going to Save the Children, but to that I would say that (i) any effort to raise money, whatever the proportion of sales/profit, is laudable and (ii) Counter still have a new premises, staff etc etc to pay for. A third of profit on 75 portfolios (plus some other prints) at ยฃ20-30k each is still going to approach something like ยฃ500k. Personally, Iโm very much in two minds about the Emin print (and a lot of the thoughts that follow could be said about all the works offered in the portfolio and CE more generally). The starting point is that I'm a collector of Tracey's work with a natural tendency to buy her releases, and this is a decent print. I haven't yet decided whether the reclining woman figure is getting a bit repetitive, or whether it is actually becoming something of a trademark motif with a number of successful variations (including the last counter release). Anyway... I am really hesitating on buying from Counter Editions on this occasion (as I did for the recent "No Surrender" release). The whole process is so off-market and atypical of how the artists would usually sell their work through other channels that it makes me slightly uncomfortable as a genuine collector, and I find myself considering the purchase for the wrong reasons. Virtually all other galleries making a offering a new release will offer Traceyโ editions (even in lower edition numbers) at a reasonable price that is generally fixed over the life of the edition, which still take weeks or months (or longer) to sell out. For example, White Cube has recently offered a few editions limited to 50 (admittedly 20-30% smaller in paper/image size), at a not dissimilar price to what CE are offering tier one of this print at. I have been in touch multiple times with White Cube to discuss those works, view them in the shop and the price hasn't changed in all that time as far as I'm aware. Yes, the editions do eventually sell out, but there is at least a chance to have a meaningful reflection on whether it's something to add to the collection. I suppose what Iโm trying to say is that if this print were being released through White Cube (or any other gallery) and was not tiered, would I rush to get it? Knowing that this is an edition of 200, I certainly wouldnโt rush. Iโd at least take a trip down to the gallery to see it in the flesh, if possible. But with Counter Editions, you HAVE to rush if you want it (or even if youโre only 60% sure you like the piece and donโt want to live with the regret/cost of missing out at an early stage). The ยฃ1,625 (or ยฃ1,300 with inevitable 20% discount) is a fair price for a Tracey Emin of this size and subject matter, but I hate feeling rushed into buying it. Also, I happen to have a meeting at work today that goes on until 2pm - I don't want to be getting out my iphone and credit card at 2:00:01 just to make sure that I'm paying the right price for an artwork. I donโt buy to resell or flip (everything I own gets framed and goes up on the wall), but I still struggle with buying at 150-300% times launch price when I had the opportunity to buy at launch. So really, Iโve concluded that Counter Editions, as great as it is, thrives mostly on (i) genuine collectorsโ FOMO, rather than a pure desire to own any particular piece and (ii) creating opportunity for flippers. Neither of which are a great reason for buying a work of art priced at four figures (or higher). The fact that I'm not a flipper doesn't make the inevitable price increases a particularly desirable reason to buy either - for instance, I bought one of the Hodgkin prints which has since increase by nearly 3x what I paid, but it's still on the wall giving me the same (not 3x) the amount of pleasure it did when I got it back from the framers. This wasnโt intended to be a moan about Counter Editions (and letโs not forget that this portfolio is a great project that benefits charity). On reflection, I think Iโm likely to give this release a miss and take the time to find another work by Tracey that I really really really want. E.g. one of the Grand Hotels, or something from an edition of 50. Maybe I'll regret passing up this opportunity, but on this occasion I think my buying decision has to be with the head rather than the heart. Did you get the Emin bronze from White cube. Edition of 50, 2.5k signed and numbered. A steal IMO. Is there a massive version of this going to a Polish Museum? I head something about that but not sure of same piece
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by Jeezuz Jones Snr on Sept 17, 2019 10:53:59 GMT 1, [br Tiering is common practice in galleries ๐คท๐ปโโ๏ธ I agree itโs to my mind pretty murky territory but there you go / itโs the world weโre in Very true. Itโs unpleasant, as it puts a buyer under pressure, and these days the lower tiers seem rarely to be available for the average buyer, which can leave a buyer paying a higher tier feeling aggrieved. But thatโs the way itโs commonly done, and no one forces anyone to buy.
Good comments on tired pricing, always wanted a nice shrigley, but itโs put me off and I wonโt be buying any of his work ๐
[br Tiering is common practice in galleries ๐คท๐ปโโ๏ธ I agree itโs to my mind pretty murky territory but there you go / itโs the world weโre in Very true. Itโs unpleasant, as it puts a buyer under pressure, and these days the lower tiers seem rarely to be available for the average buyer, which can leave a buyer paying a higher tier feeling aggrieved. But thatโs the way itโs commonly done, and no one forces anyone to buy. Good comments on tired pricing, always wanted a nice shrigley, but itโs put me off and I wonโt be buying any of his work ๐
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greeceboy
New Member
Posts โข 242
Likes โข 157
July 2017
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by greeceboy on Sept 17, 2019 10:57:14 GMT 1, 'we hate flipper, so we charge flipper rate and now we are flipper in name of charity'
-Counter Edition
'we hate flipper, so we charge flipper rate and now we are flipper in name of charity'
-Counter Edition
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blerd
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,345
Likes โข 1,195
November 2016
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by blerd on Sept 17, 2019 10:57:34 GMT 1, Did you get the Emin bronze from White cube. Edition of 50, 2.5k signed and numbered. A steal IMO. Is there a massive version of this going to a Polish Museum? I head something about that but not sure of same piece I'm not sure about that. I know Xavier Hufkens bought for their Gallery collection.
Did you get the Emin bronze from White cube. Edition of 50, 2.5k signed and numbered. A steal IMO. Is there a massive version of this going to a Polish Museum? I head something about that but not sure of same piece I'm not sure about that. I know Xavier Hufkens bought for their Gallery collection.
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ignition0
New Member
Posts โข 248
Likes โข 148
September 2018
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by ignition0 on Sept 17, 2019 11:42:32 GMT 1, Is the White Cube bronze still available?
Is the White Cube bronze still available?
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by Horatio Nelson on Sept 17, 2019 11:48:06 GMT 1, Yes, I did get the bronze! And it's the sort of thing that (if in funds) I would be happy to spend the money on every day of the week. It wouldn't surprise me if White Cube still had some of these available at the same launch price (although I know that they were coming out of the foundry in small batches at a time), which I would see as no indication of the desirability of the piece, but rather as an indication of the dedication/connoisseurship of those purchasing the works (not to say that I'm dedicated or a connoisseur...). I just know that if Counter had released the same bronze by Emin, they'd have stuck it up to ยฃ6k within 72 hours and the last dozen pieces would be gathering dust on the website at ยฃ10k or something silly. Case in point - the Rebecca Warren sculptures.
Yes, I did get the bronze! And it's the sort of thing that (if in funds) I would be happy to spend the money on every day of the week. It wouldn't surprise me if White Cube still had some of these available at the same launch price (although I know that they were coming out of the foundry in small batches at a time), which I would see as no indication of the desirability of the piece, but rather as an indication of the dedication/connoisseurship of those purchasing the works (not to say that I'm dedicated or a connoisseur...). I just know that if Counter had released the same bronze by Emin, they'd have stuck it up to ยฃ6k within 72 hours and the last dozen pieces would be gathering dust on the website at ยฃ10k or something silly. Case in point - the Rebecca Warren sculptures.
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Deleted
Posts โข 0
Likes โข
January 1970
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by Deleted on Sept 17, 2019 11:51:01 GMT 1, We should have all boycotted this release like toughart mentioned. The fact, the gallery and artists are making money off this release is pathetic. They basically used a charity to scam all their fans out of a ton of money.
Why didnโt these artists just donate one original for a auction with 100 percent profits going to the charity? Do they really need to make money off using a charity name! This is ridiculous.
By the way there is a another new Harland Miller coming out very very soon. His career is based off selling prints. Market is down and originals canโt sell so the galleries and artist are using overpriced prints to scam everyone. Be very careful right now with these extreme overpriced hand made posters with signatures and number on it (aka prints). I donโt see these prices lasting for that long or raising too much higher for a long long time.
We should have all boycotted this release like toughart mentioned. The fact, the gallery and artists are making money off this release is pathetic. They basically used a charity to scam all their fans out of a ton of money.
Why didnโt these artists just donate one original for a auction with 100 percent profits going to the charity? Do they really need to make money off using a charity name! This is ridiculous.
By the way there is a another new Harland Miller coming out very very soon. His career is based off selling prints. Market is down and originals canโt sell so the galleries and artist are using overpriced prints to scam everyone. Be very careful right now with these extreme overpriced hand made posters with signatures and number on it (aka prints). I donโt see these prices lasting for that long or raising too much higher for a long long time.
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blerd
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,345
Likes โข 1,195
November 2016
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by blerd on Sept 17, 2019 11:54:36 GMT 1, We should have all boycott this release like toughart mentioned. The fact, the gallery and artist are making money off this release is pathetic. They basically used a charity to scam all their fans out of a ton of money. Why didnโt these artists just donate one original for a auction with 100 percent profits going to the charity? Do they really need to make money off using a charity name! This is ridiculous. By the way there is a another new Harland Miller coming out very very soon. His career is based of selling prints. Market is down and originals canโt sell so the galleries and artist are using overpriced prints to scam everyone. Be very careful right now with these extreme overpriced hand made posters with signatures and number on it (aka prints). I donโt see these prices lasting for that long or raising too much higher for a long long time. Two genuine questions: 1. Are you tough art? 2. If I boycott will you buy at tier one?
We should have all boycott this release like toughart mentioned. The fact, the gallery and artist are making money off this release is pathetic. They basically used a charity to scam all their fans out of a ton of money. Why didnโt these artists just donate one original for a auction with 100 percent profits going to the charity? Do they really need to make money off using a charity name! This is ridiculous. By the way there is a another new Harland Miller coming out very very soon. His career is based of selling prints. Market is down and originals canโt sell so the galleries and artist are using overpriced prints to scam everyone. Be very careful right now with these extreme overpriced hand made posters with signatures and number on it (aka prints). I donโt see these prices lasting for that long or raising too much higher for a long long time. Two genuine questions: 1. Are you tough art? 2. If I boycott will you buy at tier one?
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Deleted
Posts โข 0
Likes โข
January 1970
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by Deleted on Sept 17, 2019 12:02:00 GMT 1, Its pathetic they are making any money off this release so I wonโt touch it at any price. Tier 1 is 15,000. If you use a charity donate all the profits not just some.... especially at their level.
People either got Millers in portfolios or are getting them today. Very few people are on this so called vip list and I doubt all these people who say they got it for less 15,000 actually did.
It didnโt sound like whitecube wanted anything to do with the release either and now I can understand.
Again another Miller coming out very soon.
Its pathetic they are making any money off this release so I wonโt touch it at any price. Tier 1 is 15,000. If you use a charity donate all the profits not just some.... especially at their level.
People either got Millers in portfolios or are getting them today. Very few people are on this so called vip list and I doubt all these people who say they got it for less 15,000 actually did.
It didnโt sound like whitecube wanted anything to do with the release either and now I can understand.
Again another Miller coming out very soon.
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greeceboy
New Member
Posts โข 242
Likes โข 157
July 2017
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by greeceboy on Sept 17, 2019 12:06:36 GMT 1, like a say worst gallery in all of Europe
like a say worst gallery in all of Europe
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by Eastend Boy 13 on Sept 17, 2019 13:21:53 GMT 1, Portfolio @ยฃ32k
Portfolio @ยฃ32k
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25127096
New Member
Posts โข 570
Likes โข 402
December 2013
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by 25127096 on Sept 17, 2019 13:22:29 GMT 1, Donโt you think itโs strange counter have turned off comments on Instagram ? I Guess they donโt want people talking about the release which seems shady as @&ยฃ#. Shutting down debate and critic seems like the new trend ๐๐๐.
Donโt you think itโs strange counter have turned off comments on Instagram ? I Guess they donโt want people talking about the release which seems shady as @&ยฃ#. Shutting down debate and critic seems like the new trend ๐๐๐.
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h.dupa
New Member
Posts โข 398
Likes โข 347
October 2017
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COUNTER EDITIONS UPCOMING PORTFOLIO RELEASE, by h.dupa on Sept 17, 2019 13:23:19 GMT 1,
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