Poly Mindset
Junior Member
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March 2014
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by Poly Mindset on Feb 9, 2016 18:32:34 GMT 1, Do you want some free art. This is how it's done.
1. Find some art for sale on Ebay in another country.
2. The art's authenticity has to be questionable i.e. no COA, questionable signature.
3. Buy the art.
4. When you get it file a claim that it is counterfeit whether it is or not.
5. Have one of your friends in a gallery fictitiously document why it is fake.
6. Ebay will side with you and get you back your money.
7. This is the kicker, in cases of counterfeit art in another country Ebay will not force the buyer to return the art.
8. You get your money back and get to keep the art.
I am putting this out here because this just happened to me to the tune of $2400. I sold a Lichtenstein Leo Castelli signed poster along with a rare Lichtenstein Raisonne' (worth $1800). The buyer claimed and documented that the poster was not authentic. How he did this I do not know as I am not privy to this information. It seemed very authentic to me but I never had it verified. In the end Ebay sided with him, refunded his money, charged my account and is letting him keep both items. In this case Ebay should force the buyer to at least send back the Raisonne' as it was not the point of contention.
I am also putting this out here for all the members on this forum who use Ebay to sell art. Beware of selling to buyers in a country other than your own. It is risky and you will not be backed up by Ebay. As a seller you have very little protection and Ebay will wash their hands of it and not back you up. Good luck and f**k Ebay.
Do you want some free art. This is how it's done.
1. Find some art for sale on Ebay in another country.
2. The art's authenticity has to be questionable i.e. no COA, questionable signature.
3. Buy the art.
4. When you get it file a claim that it is counterfeit whether it is or not.
5. Have one of your friends in a gallery fictitiously document why it is fake.
6. Ebay will side with you and get you back your money.
7. This is the kicker, in cases of counterfeit art in another country Ebay will not force the buyer to return the art.
8. You get your money back and get to keep the art.
I am putting this out here because this just happened to me to the tune of $2400. I sold a Lichtenstein Leo Castelli signed poster along with a rare Lichtenstein Raisonne' (worth $1800). The buyer claimed and documented that the poster was not authentic. How he did this I do not know as I am not privy to this information. It seemed very authentic to me but I never had it verified. In the end Ebay sided with him, refunded his money, charged my account and is letting him keep both items. In this case Ebay should force the buyer to at least send back the Raisonne' as it was not the point of contention.
I am also putting this out here for all the members on this forum who use Ebay to sell art. Beware of selling to buyers in a country other than your own. It is risky and you will not be backed up by Ebay. As a seller you have very little protection and Ebay will wash their hands of it and not back you up. Good luck and f**k Ebay.
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WOOF
Junior Member
Posts โข 4,457
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March 2014
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by WOOF on Feb 9, 2016 18:37:27 GMT 1, That's really sucks, but this comment stuck out to me...
"It seemed very authentic to me but I never had it verified."
So you're saying it very well could be a fake that you sold?
Either way, it's good to know for any ebay sellers.
That's really sucks, but this comment stuck out to me...
"It seemed very authentic to me but I never had it verified."
So you're saying it very well could be a fake that you sold?
Either way, it's good to know for any ebay sellers.
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Poly Mindset
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,174
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March 2014
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by Poly Mindset on Feb 9, 2016 18:44:15 GMT 1, That's really sucks, but this comment stuck out to me... "It seemed very authentic to me but I never had it verified." So you're saying it very well could be a fake that you sold? Either way, it's good to know for any ebay sellers.
That's really sucks, but this comment stuck out to me... "It seemed very authentic to me but I never had it verified." So you're saying it very well could be a fake that you sold? Either way, it's good to know for any ebay sellers. I never claimed that it had a COA. I did put a close up picture in the add of the signature so that potential buyers could have it verified before the purchase. It is the same signature that is on approximately 80% of the signed Lichtensteins for sale on Ebay right now. I was told that the signature was not really the point of contention. Apparently the buyer claimed that the paper used on the poster wasn't authentic. How he did this I do not know as I have not been privy to this info. |
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avec art
Junior Member
Posts โข 3,724
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March 2014
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by avec art on Feb 9, 2016 18:59:27 GMT 1, I'd of thought at the very least they ought to explain how they came to these conclusions and make the situation/buyers position, more transparent. Their arbitration process seriously needs improvement.
I'd of thought at the very least they ought to explain how they came to these conclusions and make the situation/buyers position, more transparent. Their arbitration process seriously needs improvement.
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Deleted
Posts โข 0
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January 1970
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by Deleted on Feb 9, 2016 18:59:49 GMT 1, Did you ask the seller to send the works back?
Did you ask the seller to send the works back?
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Poly Mindset
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,174
Likes โข 1,578
March 2014
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by Poly Mindset on Feb 9, 2016 19:19:31 GMT 1, I'd of thought at the very least they ought to explain how they came to these conclusions and make the situation/buyers position, more transparent. Their arbitration process seriously needs improvement.
I'd of thought at the very least they ought to explain how they came to these conclusions and make the situation/buyers position, more transparent. Their arbitration process seriously needs improvement. Absolutely. They will not disclose any information to me about how they came to their decision. I have tried to contact the buyer but he has gone silent. The fact is that if you give a refund willingly or are forced to give a refund you should get your art back. I believe Ebay doesn't want you to get your art back because if you can verify that it is authentic and they are wrong then it creates a problem for them. They would just rather wash their hands of it. Bottom line is the seller should get their art back regardless. The fact is that is how it happens here in the USA, the buyer does get his art back. The rules are different in different countries. That's why I am trying to warn members not to sell outside your own country. |
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Deleted
Posts โข 0
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January 1970
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by Deleted on Feb 9, 2016 19:32:45 GMT 1, I am putting this out here because this just happened to me to the tune of $2400. I sold a Lichtenstein Leo Castelli signed poster along with a rare Lichtenstein Raisonne' (worth $1800). The buyer claimed and documented that the poster was not authentic. How he did this I do not know as I am not privy to this information. It seemed very authentic to me but I never had it verified. In the end Ebay sided with him, refunded his money, charged my account and is letting him keep both items. In this case Ebay should force the buyer to at least send back the Raisonne' as it was not the point of contention. I am also putting this out here for all the members on this forum who use Ebay to sell art. Beware of selling to buyers in a country other than your own. It is risky and you will not be backed up by Ebay. As a seller you have very little protection and Ebay will wash their hands of it and not back you up. Good luck and f**k Ebay.
It's not good mate, Ebay has always had it's fair share of baddies, whichever platform you choose to sell your wares you will always get the knobhead who wants to diddle you.
Ebay will nine times out of ten always side with the buyer, rather than disputing the case which you must have done for Ebay to close the case in favour of the buyer, you should have just told them to send it back for a full refund. (I am just presuming, not knowing the full story of course)
It's absolutely gutting when something like this happens having had it done to myself and seen it done to others.
Maybe you could share the user name so those of us that use Ebay can put them on our blocked list.
Everything for a reason (although we might not always understand why) but what goes around comes around.
Keep your chin up
I am putting this out here because this just happened to me to the tune of $2400. I sold a Lichtenstein Leo Castelli signed poster along with a rare Lichtenstein Raisonne' (worth $1800). The buyer claimed and documented that the poster was not authentic. How he did this I do not know as I am not privy to this information. It seemed very authentic to me but I never had it verified. In the end Ebay sided with him, refunded his money, charged my account and is letting him keep both items. In this case Ebay should force the buyer to at least send back the Raisonne' as it was not the point of contention. I am also putting this out here for all the members on this forum who use Ebay to sell art. Beware of selling to buyers in a country other than your own. It is risky and you will not be backed up by Ebay. As a seller you have very little protection and Ebay will wash their hands of it and not back you up. Good luck and f**k Ebay. It's not good mate, Ebay has always had it's fair share of baddies, whichever platform you choose to sell your wares you will always get the knobhead who wants to diddle you. Ebay will nine times out of ten always side with the buyer, rather than disputing the case which you must have done for Ebay to close the case in favour of the buyer, you should have just told them to send it back for a full refund. (I am just presuming, not knowing the full story of course) It's absolutely gutting when something like this happens having had it done to myself and seen it done to others. Maybe you could share the user name so those of us that use Ebay can put them on our blocked list. Everything for a reason (although we might not always understand why) but what goes around comes around. Keep your chin up |
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Poly Mindset
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,174
Likes โข 1,578
March 2014
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by Poly Mindset on Feb 9, 2016 19:54:29 GMT 1, I am putting this out here because this just happened to me to the tune of $2400. I sold a Lichtenstein Leo Castelli signed poster along with a rare Lichtenstein Raisonne' (worth $1800). The buyer claimed and documented that the poster was not authentic. How he did this I do not know as I am not privy to this information. It seemed very authentic to me but I never had it verified. In the end Ebay sided with him, refunded his money, charged my account and is letting him keep both items. In this case Ebay should force the buyer to at least send back the Raisonne' as it was not the point of contention. I am also putting this out here for all the members on this forum who use Ebay to sell art. Beware of selling to buyers in a country other than your own. It is risky and you will not be backed up by Ebay. As a seller you have very little protection and Ebay will wash their hands of it and not back you up. Good luck and f**k Ebay. It's not good mate, Ebay has always had it's fair share of baddies, whichever platform you choose to sell your wares you will always get the knobhead who wants to diddle you. Ebay will nine times out of ten always side with the buyer, rather than disputing the case which you must have done for Ebay to close the case in favour of the buyer, you should have just told them to send it back for a full refund. (I am just presuming, not knowing the full story of course) It's absolutely gutting when something like this happens having had it done to myself and seen it done to others. Maybe you could share the user name so those of us that use Ebay can put them on our blocked list. Everything for a reason (although we might not always understand why) but what goes around comes around. Keep your chin up
I am putting this out here because this just happened to me to the tune of $2400. I sold a Lichtenstein Leo Castelli signed poster along with a rare Lichtenstein Raisonne' (worth $1800). The buyer claimed and documented that the poster was not authentic. How he did this I do not know as I am not privy to this information. It seemed very authentic to me but I never had it verified. In the end Ebay sided with him, refunded his money, charged my account and is letting him keep both items. In this case Ebay should force the buyer to at least send back the Raisonne' as it was not the point of contention. I am also putting this out here for all the members on this forum who use Ebay to sell art. Beware of selling to buyers in a country other than your own. It is risky and you will not be backed up by Ebay. As a seller you have very little protection and Ebay will wash their hands of it and not back you up. Good luck and f**k Ebay. It's not good mate, Ebay has always had it's fair share of baddies, whichever platform you choose to sell your wares you will always get the knobhead who wants to diddle you. Ebay will nine times out of ten always side with the buyer, rather than disputing the case which you must have done for Ebay to close the case in favour of the buyer, you should have just told them to send it back for a full refund. (I am just presuming, not knowing the full story of course) It's absolutely gutting when something like this happens having had it done to myself and seen it done to others. Maybe you could share the user name so those of us that use Ebay can put them on our blocked list. Everything for a reason (although we might not always understand why) but what goes around comes around. Keep your chin up elmeg2015 is the buyer. I had offered to give him a refund of $550 for the poster which he accepted but put the stipulation that I had to give it to him on that day. I refused to do that because it left me no guarantee that I would get the poster back and if I did what condition would it be in. Yes, the whole ordeal has been screwed from the start. Live and learn. I know now that I will never use Ebay to sell or buy anything again. I am closing my account. |
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by Coach on Feb 9, 2016 20:59:25 GMT 1, This is appalling poly. I can't understand why the buyer wouldn't just return your stuff now they have had their money back. What a cad!! How can people live with themselves? If I was sat here now with your art and book and all my money back, I would be feeling so guilty.
I really feel for you. Hope you can get it resolved.
None of this is much help I know.
This is appalling poly. I can't understand why the buyer wouldn't just return your stuff now they have had their money back. What a cad!! How can people live with themselves? If I was sat here now with your art and book and all my money back, I would be feeling so guilty.
I really feel for you. Hope you can get it resolved.
None of this is much help I know.
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ABC
Artist
Junior Member
Posts โข 5,533
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August 2006
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by ABC on Feb 9, 2016 22:08:35 GMT 1, Morals don't factor into most people lives anymore Coach, sad indeed
It's a real shame but can relate as when I first sold a few things I got ripped off for the sum of ยฃ1k on a Laptop (I sent to a non confirmed address and got stung) Ebay is geared up for buyers and certainly not for sellers. I thought though that for us in the UK, using the Ebay Global Shipping program would stop this sort of thing. After all when it arrives at the hub, Ebay are in fact signing to say they have received it. Then again could be barking up the wrong tree on that.
Morals don't factor into most people lives anymore Coach, sad indeed
It's a real shame but can relate as when I first sold a few things I got ripped off for the sum of ยฃ1k on a Laptop (I sent to a non confirmed address and got stung) Ebay is geared up for buyers and certainly not for sellers. I thought though that for us in the UK, using the Ebay Global Shipping program would stop this sort of thing. After all when it arrives at the hub, Ebay are in fact signing to say they have received it. Then again could be barking up the wrong tree on that.
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robertjones
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,506
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February 2013
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by robertjones on Feb 9, 2016 22:11:58 GMT 1, What goes around comes around & hope you get it sorted out !
What goes around comes around & hope you get it sorted out !
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Poly Mindset
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,174
Likes โข 1,578
March 2014
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by Poly Mindset on Feb 9, 2016 23:08:24 GMT 1, This is appalling poly. I can't understand why the buyer wouldn't just return your stuff now they have had their money back. What a cad!! How can people live with themselves? If I was sat here now with your art and book and all my money back, I would be feeling so guilty. I really feel for you. Hope you can get it resolved. None of this is much help I know.
This is appalling poly. I can't understand why the buyer wouldn't just return your stuff now they have had their money back. What a cad!! How can people live with themselves? If I was sat here now with your art and book and all my money back, I would be feeling so guilty. I really feel for you. Hope you can get it resolved. None of this is much help I know. Thanks Coach and maybe that may happen, but I don't get the feeling that it will. However, personally it doesn't matter to me because I hold myself to a higher moral code. Yes, I got screwed and it will be a set back at a time when I need it least (with the divorce and all), but I will rise above it. I'm sure that there are many members here who can vouch for me as I have sold some very nice art at reasonable if not lower monetary values than they were worth to some wonderful forum members. I do believe this forum is truly a God send for people who are involved and appreciate what is happening today in art. I think we need to collectively respect each other as collectors and appreciators and not use this forum as a vehicle to make great profits. I honestly don't think that is what happens here on this forum and I am grateful for that. I personally will keep enjoying and believing in this forum and collecting what I can afford. Thanks for all the well wishes and just be careful with your Ebay sales. |
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by Coach on Feb 9, 2016 23:41:07 GMT 1, This is appalling poly. I can't understand why the buyer wouldn't just return your stuff now they have had their money back. What a cad!! How can people live with themselves? If I was sat here now with your art and book and all my money back, I would be feeling so guilty. I really feel for you. Hope you can get it resolved. None of this is much help I know. Thanks Coach and maybe that may happen, but I don't get the feeling that it will. However, personally it doesn't matter to me because I hold myself to a higher moral code. Yes, I got screwed and it will be a set back at a time when I need it least (with the divorce and all), but I will rise above it. I'm sure that there are many members here who can vouch for me as I have sold some very nice art at reasonable if not lower monetary values than they were worth to some wonderful forum members. I do believe this forum is truly a God send for people who are involved and appreciate what is happening today in art. I think we need to collectively respect each other as collectors and appreciators and not use this forum as a vehicle to make great profits. I honestly don't think that is what happens here on this forum and I am grateful for that. I personally will keep enjoying and believing in this forum and collecting what I can afford. Thanks for all the well wishes and just be careful with your Ebay sales.ย
I am not sure I could be do calm about it.
I have never sold any art on eBay. Your story puts me off even trying!
This is appalling poly. I can't understand why the buyer wouldn't just return your stuff now they have had their money back. What a cad!! How can people live with themselves? If I was sat here now with your art and book and all my money back, I would be feeling so guilty. I really feel for you. Hope you can get it resolved. None of this is much help I know. Thanks Coach and maybe that may happen, but I don't get the feeling that it will. However, personally it doesn't matter to me because I hold myself to a higher moral code. Yes, I got screwed and it will be a set back at a time when I need it least (with the divorce and all), but I will rise above it. I'm sure that there are many members here who can vouch for me as I have sold some very nice art at reasonable if not lower monetary values than they were worth to some wonderful forum members. I do believe this forum is truly a God send for people who are involved and appreciate what is happening today in art. I think we need to collectively respect each other as collectors and appreciators and not use this forum as a vehicle to make great profits. I honestly don't think that is what happens here on this forum and I am grateful for that. I personally will keep enjoying and believing in this forum and collecting what I can afford. Thanks for all the well wishes and just be careful with your Ebay sales.ย I am not sure I could be do calm about it. I have never sold any art on eBay. Your story puts me off even trying! |
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by Lroy on Feb 10, 2016 9:07:52 GMT 1, Did you ask the seller to send the works back?
good question that nobody answered !
I
Ask him first, then if he does not want , threaten him to go to the police, make a claim against him that you can send to eBay too, yo can also tell him that. You can pass at his home with mates. He has to send you back the posters. Even Paypal
Is asking that also : did you put a claim on Paypal too ?
The methods seem rude but if you want your posters back, do it ...
It happened to me, a young big wanker who sold me a fake Banksy signature on a Berlin festival movie poster ( 400 quids )
I threatened him to denounce him to Scotland Yard ( with links about fake and consequences ) , the day after his mother sent me back the
Money.
I know I was the seller , but the case is the same , eBay did not want then to hear about a refund from him etc ., police is the main word in these case of robs.
Did you ask the seller to send the works back? good question that nobody answered ! I Ask him first, then if he does not want , threaten him to go to the police, make a claim against him that you can send to eBay too, yo can also tell him that. You can pass at his home with mates. He has to send you back the posters. Even Paypal Is asking that also : did you put a claim on Paypal too ? The methods seem rude but if you want your posters back, do it ... It happened to me, a young big wanker who sold me a fake Banksy signature on a Berlin festival movie poster ( 400 quids ) I threatened him to denounce him to Scotland Yard ( with links about fake and consequences ) , the day after his mother sent me back the Money. I know I was the seller , but the case is the same , eBay did not want then to hear about a refund from him etc ., police is the main word in these case of robs. |
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kel
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,111
Likes โข 511
October 2008
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by kel on Feb 10, 2016 11:36:56 GMT 1, So many grey areas when dealing with eBay one of your angles that might be worth looking at is dependant on which site you listed it on. If you listed on .UK, .FR or .IT then the sales criteria is responsible for that country as it was sold within that country. Therefore if eBay are implementing sales refunds based on .com policy as all countries have different policies then that is not in accordance to the sales agreement that you signed up for.
As I said grey area but might be worth looking into.
So many grey areas when dealing with eBay one of your angles that might be worth looking at is dependant on which site you listed it on. If you listed on .UK, .FR or .IT then the sales criteria is responsible for that country as it was sold within that country. Therefore if eBay are implementing sales refunds based on .com policy as all countries have different policies then that is not in accordance to the sales agreement that you signed up for.
As I said grey area but might be worth looking into.
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by searchandrescue on Feb 10, 2016 13:59:26 GMT 1, so sorry you had an awful experience. Hopefully with your advice and a bit of looking out for each other on here this is less likely to happen again. Gutting.
so sorry you had an awful experience. Hopefully with your advice and a bit of looking out for each other on here this is less likely to happen again. Gutting.
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Alpha Cap
New Member
Posts โข 226
Likes โข 231
June 2013
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Ebay gives buyer a license to steal, by Alpha Cap on Feb 14, 2016 10:59:47 GMT 1, That's really sucks, but this comment stuck out to me... "It seemed very authentic to me but I never had it verified." So you're saying it very well could be a fake that you sold? Either way, it's good to know for any ebay sellers. I never claimed that it had a COA. I did put a close up picture in the add of the signature so that potential buyers could have it verified before the purchase. It is the same signature that is on approximately 80% of the signed Lichtensteins for sale on Ebay right now. I was told that the signature was not really the point of contention. Apparently the buyer claimed that the paper used on the poster wasn't authentic. How he did this I do not know as I have not been privy to this info.
That's really sucks, but this comment stuck out to me... "It seemed very authentic to me but I never had it verified." So you're saying it very well could be a fake that you sold? Either way, it's good to know for any ebay sellers. I never claimed that it had a COA. I did put a close up picture in the add of the signature so that potential buyers could have it verified before the purchase. It is the same signature that is on approximately 80% of the signed Lichtensteins for sale on Ebay right now. I was told that the signature was not really the point of contention. Apparently the buyer claimed that the paper used on the poster wasn't authentic. How he did this I do not know as I have not been privy to this info. There are so many fakes on Lichtenstein. I sold my collection because of that years ago. Very hard to tell wich ones are fakes. |
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