Deleted
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January 1970
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Hmp news, by Deleted on Jul 29, 2013 14:06:12 GMT 1, Wonder what Dolk images they'll release? I hope they finally release this one. I think I really like this, would need to see it for real, whats it saying? looks a bit girl and her teddy which is a very depressing image, though I had to have it What its saying is he cant draw, well not on this one.
Wonder what Dolk images they'll release? I hope they finally release this one. I think I really like this, would need to see it for real, whats it saying? looks a bit girl and her teddy which is a very depressing image, though I had to have it What its saying is he cant draw, well not on this one.
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Manty
New Member
Posts โข 956
Likes โข 574
May 2013
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Hmp news, by Manty on Jul 29, 2013 18:39:49 GMT 1, Nigel
how very dare you
You Sir have no taste when it comes to pretty pictures, look at mums happy smily face (or is it dads?)
Nigel
how very dare you
You Sir have no taste when it comes to pretty pictures, look at mums happy smily face (or is it dads?)
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Deleted
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January 1970
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Hmp news, by Deleted on Jul 29, 2013 18:59:05 GMT 1, I know, soz.
I know, soz.
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Gard
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,604
Likes โข 1,243
June 2012
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Hmp news, by Gard on Jul 29, 2013 19:02:35 GMT 1, Hang will look pretty sweet as a print
Hang will look pretty sweet as a print
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Deleted
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January 1970
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Hmp news, by Deleted on Jul 29, 2013 19:03:51 GMT 1, ?, are you Dolks mum or something?, you have lots of his works!, quite like that.
?, are you Dolks mum or something?, you have lots of his works!, quite like that.
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Ruggs
Full Member
Posts โข 8,952
Likes โข 4,575
January 2008
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Hmp news, by Ruggs on Jul 29, 2013 19:13:40 GMT 1, Nice that!
Nice that!
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Deleted
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January 1970
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Hmp news
Jul 29, 2013 20:09:58 GMT 1
via mobile
Hmp news, by Deleted on Jul 29, 2013 20:09:58 GMT 1, Would love it to be hang !!!!!
Would love it to be hang !!!!!
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seqret
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,133
Likes โข 1,135
October 2011
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Hmp news, by seqret on Jul 29, 2013 20:12:43 GMT 1, Hang will look pretty sweet as a print My fav piece from him. Wish to own. Are there any canvases from Dolk that you don't have gard?
Hang will look pretty sweet as a print My fav piece from him. Wish to own. Are there any canvases from Dolk that you don't have gard?
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Karl Read
Artist
Junior Member
Posts โข 3,553
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April 2008
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Hmp news, by Karl Read on Jul 29, 2013 20:24:18 GMT 1, I'd quite like to see this as the next print:
I'd quite like to see this as the next print:
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stvro22
New Member
Posts โข 668
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February 2013
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Hmp news
Jul 30, 2013 13:16:00 GMT 1
via mobile
Hmp news, by stvro22 on Jul 30, 2013 13:16:00 GMT 1, Looking forward to Dolk's show indeed. Does anyone feel since Bansky's layoff Dolk's keeping the fire burning or does he not do enough street pieces?
Looking forward to Dolk's show indeed. Does anyone feel since Bansky's layoff Dolk's keeping the fire burning or does he not do enough street pieces?
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iamzero
Full Member
Posts โข 9,188
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May 2011
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Hmp news
Jul 30, 2013 13:33:21 GMT 1
via mobile
Hmp news, by iamzero on Jul 30, 2013 13:33:21 GMT 1, Hmmmm you never see Dolk and Banksy in the same room at the same time...
Hmmmm you never see Dolk and Banksy in the same room at the same time...
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street4RT
New Member
Posts โข 304
Likes โข 36
May 2013
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Gulosten
New Member
Posts โข 526
Likes โข 216
March 2012
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Hmp news, by Gulosten on Jul 30, 2013 14:03:13 GMT 1, Looking forward to Dolk's show indeed. Does anyone feel since Bansky's layoff Dolk's keeping the fire burning or does he not do enough street pieces? He's done quite a few the last year:
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mmmike
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,419
Likes โข 759
March 2010
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Hmp news, by mmmike on Jul 30, 2013 16:25:27 GMT 1, Looking forward to Dolk's show indeed. Does anyone feel since Bansky's layoff Dolk's keeping the fire burning or does he not do enough street pieces? Nope IMO most of his stuff is pretty boring. He is only similar to Banksy in that he copies Banksy's style a bit. But most of his stuff, prints especially are a bit of a bore to me. I know I'm in the minority here but I don't see what all the fuss is about. I think it is just people hyping him up because at a quick glance the work looks kinda Banksy like so it is an easy sale, people are hoping to make some quick cash.
Looking forward to Dolk's show indeed. Does anyone feel since Bansky's layoff Dolk's keeping the fire burning or does he not do enough street pieces? Nope IMO most of his stuff is pretty boring. He is only similar to Banksy in that he copies Banksy's style a bit. But most of his stuff, prints especially are a bit of a bore to me. I know I'm in the minority here but I don't see what all the fuss is about. I think it is just people hyping him up because at a quick glance the work looks kinda Banksy like so it is an easy sale, people are hoping to make some quick cash.
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The Origin
New Member
Posts โข 934
Likes โข 993
November 2011
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Hmp news, by The Origin on Jul 31, 2013 21:05:37 GMT 1, Hoping he releases angel toy at some point. Think it would make a great print and look nice hung with toy! Not sure he will release another 'graffiti scribbles' print so soon after evolution though.
Hoping he releases angel toy at some point. Think it would make a great print and look nice hung with toy! Not sure he will release another 'graffiti scribbles' print so soon after evolution though.
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graffuturism
New Member
Posts โข 754
Likes โข 771
March 2010
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Hmp news, by graffuturism on Jul 31, 2013 21:48:43 GMT 1, Looking forward to Dolk's show indeed. Does anyone feel since Bansky's layoff Dolk's keeping the fire burning or does he not do enough street pieces? Nope IMO most of his stuff is pretty boring. He is only similar to Banksy in that he copies Banksy's style a bit. But most of his stuff, prints especially are a bit of a bore to me. I know I'm in the minority here but I don't see what all the fuss is about. I think it is just people hyping him up because at a quick glance the work looks kinda Banksy like so it is an easy sale, people are hoping to make some quick cash.
I have not figured out the fascination with this artist within this forum either. I search the internet daily for art and artists updates, I can say that I am pretty familiar with most artists and besides this forum I dont see this artist being talked about at all. You would think that someone who has a very similar style as an original like banksy would get slack for resembling him so much, but its the opposite atleast in here. It shows the power and demand for banksy is so high that all one has to do is make a decent copy of his work and you as well can sell prints for more money than 90% of other well established street artists. I would agree with most of these points made above and say that to each their own I am sure if you are buying for appreciation nothing matters other than what you think. To the others buying to flip or wondering if this artist will be in fact the next rising star I would say unlikely. This forum and London can drive one artists price up for so long until people realize that what we have here is a perfect example of being in the right place at the right time.
I base my opinions on observations such as one he doesnt paint as much as you would like to see someone who is supposed to be the next big thing. Artists that continue to work in the street tend to more genuine and dedicated over the longrun. You can tell alot about an artist about how hard he works and that could also mean in the studio and streets. To me dropping prints is an afterthought to an artist that is really accomplishing a real body of work. Second now that this artist is in this position with a style that everyone can see resembles banksy what is he doing to create his own genuine identity. Artists can evolve and those that do usually will show themselves to be more inclined for long term success IMO.Even if this new style distnaces himself from his collectors. One its not his style in the first place and two I would like to see what his hand or mark looks like. What does a Dolk look like? 3rd his market has been established in one country or area mostly and if you are paying as much as you are paying for his prints wouldnt you like to know that it wasnt a local phenonem. I dont see him getting any appreciation around the world. This is not a direct attack on Dolk as much as it is a direct comment on most the artists I see in this forum being collected for what In my opinion are wrong reasons. The one reason that doesnt matter is that you love the image or work, that I cannot argue against what one likes is what one likes. This is an attempt to show you some of the thinking that I take into looking at an artist when doing features or choosing to exhibit or buy. Its important to look past the superficial if you really want to guess where an artists might end up say in 5-10 years. Apologize to Dolk for using him as an example but figured it was fair game he is raking it in regardless not sure he would care.
Looking forward to Dolk's show indeed. Does anyone feel since Bansky's layoff Dolk's keeping the fire burning or does he not do enough street pieces? Nope IMO most of his stuff is pretty boring. He is only similar to Banksy in that he copies Banksy's style a bit. But most of his stuff, prints especially are a bit of a bore to me. I know I'm in the minority here but I don't see what all the fuss is about. I think it is just people hyping him up because at a quick glance the work looks kinda Banksy like so it is an easy sale, people are hoping to make some quick cash. I have not figured out the fascination with this artist within this forum either. I search the internet daily for art and artists updates, I can say that I am pretty familiar with most artists and besides this forum I dont see this artist being talked about at all. You would think that someone who has a very similar style as an original like banksy would get slack for resembling him so much, but its the opposite atleast in here. It shows the power and demand for banksy is so high that all one has to do is make a decent copy of his work and you as well can sell prints for more money than 90% of other well established street artists. I would agree with most of these points made above and say that to each their own I am sure if you are buying for appreciation nothing matters other than what you think. To the others buying to flip or wondering if this artist will be in fact the next rising star I would say unlikely. This forum and London can drive one artists price up for so long until people realize that what we have here is a perfect example of being in the right place at the right time. I base my opinions on observations such as one he doesnt paint as much as you would like to see someone who is supposed to be the next big thing. Artists that continue to work in the street tend to more genuine and dedicated over the longrun. You can tell alot about an artist about how hard he works and that could also mean in the studio and streets. To me dropping prints is an afterthought to an artist that is really accomplishing a real body of work. Second now that this artist is in this position with a style that everyone can see resembles banksy what is he doing to create his own genuine identity. Artists can evolve and those that do usually will show themselves to be more inclined for long term success IMO.Even if this new style distnaces himself from his collectors. One its not his style in the first place and two I would like to see what his hand or mark looks like. What does a Dolk look like? 3rd his market has been established in one country or area mostly and if you are paying as much as you are paying for his prints wouldnt you like to know that it wasnt a local phenonem. I dont see him getting any appreciation around the world. This is not a direct attack on Dolk as much as it is a direct comment on most the artists I see in this forum being collected for what In my opinion are wrong reasons. The one reason that doesnt matter is that you love the image or work, that I cannot argue against what one likes is what one likes. This is an attempt to show you some of the thinking that I take into looking at an artist when doing features or choosing to exhibit or buy. Its important to look past the superficial if you really want to guess where an artists might end up say in 5-10 years. Apologize to Dolk for using him as an example but figured it was fair game he is raking it in regardless not sure he would care.
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mmmike
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,419
Likes โข 759
March 2010
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Hmp news, by mmmike on Jul 31, 2013 21:56:36 GMT 1, graffuturism them are fightin words. I think you will get some strong disagreement here.
graffuturism them are fightin words. I think you will get some strong disagreement here.
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graffuturism
New Member
Posts โข 754
Likes โข 771
March 2010
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Hmp news, by graffuturism on Jul 31, 2013 22:07:24 GMT 1, graffuturism them are fightin words. I think you will get some strong disagreement here.
Haha I can only be honest and provide a different perspective. In this case its the perspective of most everyone outside this forum. Nobody respects an artist who makes a living off copying another artists style this has been said to me by many others as well. An artist like Dran for example is another story and there is very good reason to think that Dran will be around for awhile and remain very relevant. For some of the same reasons mentioned above but in a good way. I am not trying to attack peoples view only provide some real critique.
graffuturism them are fightin words. I think you will get some strong disagreement here. Haha I can only be honest and provide a different perspective. In this case its the perspective of most everyone outside this forum. Nobody respects an artist who makes a living off copying another artists style this has been said to me by many others as well. An artist like Dran for example is another story and there is very good reason to think that Dran will be around for awhile and remain very relevant. For some of the same reasons mentioned above but in a good way. I am not trying to attack peoples view only provide some real critique.
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mmmike
Junior Member
Posts โข 2,419
Likes โข 759
March 2010
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Hmp news, by mmmike on Jul 31, 2013 22:14:40 GMT 1, graffuturism them are fightin words. I think you will get some strong disagreement here. Haha I can only be honest and provide a different perspective. In this case its the perspective of most everyone outside this forum. Nobody respects an artist who makes a living off copying another artists style this has been said to me by many others as well. An artist like Dran for example is another story and there is very good reason to think that Dran will be around for awhile and remain very relevant. For some of the same reasons mentioned above but in a good way. I am not trying to attack peoples view only provide some real critique. I love it. i think there should be more debate here. I don't see the big deal with Dran either. But then again I have strange taste. For the past couple years I've been crazy about Eric Haze. I think there are two others on this forum who like him.
Most of the time I bite my tongue when people post art that I think is crap because I think everyone has a right to like what they like and my opinion is no more valuable than anyone else. BUT when it comes to guys where it just smells too much like a pyramid scheme, hyping up prices with no substance (Dolk, MBW etc.) then I don't mind giving my opinion.
graffuturism them are fightin words. I think you will get some strong disagreement here. Haha I can only be honest and provide a different perspective. In this case its the perspective of most everyone outside this forum. Nobody respects an artist who makes a living off copying another artists style this has been said to me by many others as well. An artist like Dran for example is another story and there is very good reason to think that Dran will be around for awhile and remain very relevant. For some of the same reasons mentioned above but in a good way. I am not trying to attack peoples view only provide some real critique. I love it. i think there should be more debate here. I don't see the big deal with Dran either. But then again I have strange taste. For the past couple years I've been crazy about Eric Haze. I think there are two others on this forum who like him. Most of the time I bite my tongue when people post art that I think is crap because I think everyone has a right to like what they like and my opinion is no more valuable than anyone else. BUT when it comes to guys where it just smells too much like a pyramid scheme, hyping up prices with no substance (Dolk, MBW etc.) then I don't mind giving my opinion.
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Feral Things
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,848
Likes โข 3,654
January 2012
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Hmp news, by Feral Things on Jul 31, 2013 22:40:32 GMT 1, On the back of Graffuturism's comments, can I ask what people think Dolk's work is about? I'm not really a big fan of his work so I haven't read any interviews with him but he doesn't seem to explain his work very much, if at all. Do people think he's got a particular meaning in mind for a piece? Or does he not have a particular meaning in mind but wants viewers to find their own meaning? Or is it just about the aesthetics and nothing more than that? Or is it something else again?
I promise that this is a genuine question, but I'm conscious that people questioning what appeals to others about an artist they're not a fan of can come across as attacking that artist and this definitely isn't my intention. I'd be interested to see what people take from his work.
On the back of Graffuturism's comments, can I ask what people think Dolk's work is about? I'm not really a big fan of his work so I haven't read any interviews with him but he doesn't seem to explain his work very much, if at all. Do people think he's got a particular meaning in mind for a piece? Or does he not have a particular meaning in mind but wants viewers to find their own meaning? Or is it just about the aesthetics and nothing more than that? Or is it something else again?
I promise that this is a genuine question, but I'm conscious that people questioning what appeals to others about an artist they're not a fan of can come across as attacking that artist and this definitely isn't my intention. I'd be interested to see what people take from his work.
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gravity1
New Member
Posts โข 777
Likes โข 492
January 2013
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Hmp news, by gravity1 on Jul 31, 2013 23:15:11 GMT 1, Seems hard to make a case for either side since it is "Art" and couldn't be any more subjective. I do believe that most creativity, no matter who it's from, is usually drawn to some degree from observing other creative efforts. I think it's tough being in the art mix and on this board and not in some way be affected by opinions, prices and disputes we see every day. But what I experience, as I'm sure many members do as well, is when I have people over the house who have little to zero art knowledge and exposure, especially urban art, and observing which pieces strike them and in what ways. Again this means nothing but it is interesting to me.
I remember a month or so back commenting on a Hirst piece because I just couldn't believe that colored dots, made by an artist's assistant non the less, was going for so much scratch. Then owner of the piece acknowledged my points but said when people came over it was always the first piece they went to, which really opened my eyes to this point that no one could ever see though someone else's eyes or deprogram all the societal prejudices the art community instills in us all. We can never know what others see in a piece or their motivations in buying one. Seems almost as futile as a debate on which religion has more merit and comparing their motivations, inspirations and subscriber base.
On the back of Graffuturism's comments, can I ask what people think Dolk's work is about? I'm not really a big fan of his work so I haven't read any interviews with him but he doesn't seem to explain his work very much, if at all. Do people think he's got a particular meaning in mind for a piece? Or does he not have a particular meaning in mind but wants viewers to find their own meaning? Or is it just about the aesthetics and nothing more than that? Or is it something else again? I promise that this is a genuine question, but I'm conscious that people questioning what appeals to others about an artist they're not a fan of can come across as attacking that artist and this definitely isn't my intention. I'd be interested to see what people take from his work.
Seems hard to make a case for either side since it is "Art" and couldn't be any more subjective. I do believe that most creativity, no matter who it's from, is usually drawn to some degree from observing other creative efforts. I think it's tough being in the art mix and on this board and not in some way be affected by opinions, prices and disputes we see every day. But what I experience, as I'm sure many members do as well, is when I have people over the house who have little to zero art knowledge and exposure, especially urban art, and observing which pieces strike them and in what ways. Again this means nothing but it is interesting to me. I remember a month or so back commenting on a Hirst piece because I just couldn't believe that colored dots, made by an artist's assistant non the less, was going for so much scratch. Then owner of the piece acknowledged my points but said when people came over it was always the first piece they went to, which really opened my eyes to this point that no one could ever see though someone else's eyes or deprogram all the societal prejudices the art community instills in us all. We can never know what others see in a piece or their motivations in buying one. Seems almost as futile as a debate on which religion has more merit and comparing their motivations, inspirations and subscriber base. On the back of Graffuturism's comments, can I ask what people think Dolk's work is about? I'm not really a big fan of his work so I haven't read any interviews with him but he doesn't seem to explain his work very much, if at all. Do people think he's got a particular meaning in mind for a piece? Or does he not have a particular meaning in mind but wants viewers to find their own meaning? Or is it just about the aesthetics and nothing more than that? Or is it something else again? I promise that this is a genuine question, but I'm conscious that people questioning what appeals to others about an artist they're not a fan of can come across as attacking that artist and this definitely isn't my intention. I'd be interested to see what people take from his work.
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Deleted
Posts โข 0
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January 1970
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Hmp news, by Deleted on Jul 31, 2013 23:39:33 GMT 1, So you're basically saying everyone has a different opinion.
' never has so much been said by so many that says so little '
So you're basically saying everyone has a different opinion.
' never has so much been said by so many that says so little '
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Deleted
Posts โข 0
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January 1970
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Hmp news
Aug 1, 2013 0:01:53 GMT 1
via mobile
Hmp news, by Deleted on Aug 1, 2013 0:01:53 GMT 1, graffuturism them are fightin words. I think you will get some strong disagreement here. Haha I can only be honest and provide a different perspective. In this case its the perspective of most everyone outside this forum. Nobody respects an artist who makes a living off copying another artists style this has been said to me by many others as well. An artist like Dran for example is another story and there is very good reason to think that Dran will be around for awhile and remain very relevant. For some of the same reasons mentioned above but in a good way. I am not trying to attack peoples view only provide some real critique.
That's a fair point; everyone likes different things and looks for different things in art and your post is much more constructive than the usual 'Well Banksy is great and Dolk is sh*t' argument you hear from some people!
I don't like the nonrepresentational art you were talking about in a recent thread. Now please please understand that this isn't just a silly tit for tat argument I'm trying to start here, far from it, I'm just saying that I don't understand what I'm looking at but you yourself can clearly see something in it - which is great - but it's just not for me at all. Even respected artists like Mr Jago do nothing for me because I need to see 'something' when I look at art. Whether its obvious what that something is doing in the print or what that aomething is trying to say is a different matter and is open to interpretation but i just need to see an object that i can clearly identify. It's said that Dolk does give a meaning to his prints but keeps it to himself, I'm fine with that as I give them my own meanings. Do I like all of his prints? no, but I do like most of them. I enjoy looking at them which, despite what some art snobs say, is really the main reason for buying an artists work.
I'm glad we have all types and styles of art, even artists I just don't 'get', as I was always told when I was young that the world would be a very boring place if we all liked the same thing : )
graffuturism them are fightin words. I think you will get some strong disagreement here. Haha I can only be honest and provide a different perspective. In this case its the perspective of most everyone outside this forum. Nobody respects an artist who makes a living off copying another artists style this has been said to me by many others as well. An artist like Dran for example is another story and there is very good reason to think that Dran will be around for awhile and remain very relevant. For some of the same reasons mentioned above but in a good way. I am not trying to attack peoples view only provide some real critique. That's a fair point; everyone likes different things and looks for different things in art and your post is much more constructive than the usual 'Well Banksy is great and Dolk is sh*t' argument you hear from some people! I don't like the nonrepresentational art you were talking about in a recent thread. Now please please understand that this isn't just a silly tit for tat argument I'm trying to start here, far from it, I'm just saying that I don't understand what I'm looking at but you yourself can clearly see something in it - which is great - but it's just not for me at all. Even respected artists like Mr Jago do nothing for me because I need to see 'something' when I look at art. Whether its obvious what that something is doing in the print or what that aomething is trying to say is a different matter and is open to interpretation but i just need to see an object that i can clearly identify. It's said that Dolk does give a meaning to his prints but keeps it to himself, I'm fine with that as I give them my own meanings. Do I like all of his prints? no, but I do like most of them. I enjoy looking at them which, despite what some art snobs say, is really the main reason for buying an artists work. I'm glad we have all types and styles of art, even artists I just don't 'get', as I was always told when I was young that the world would be a very boring place if we all liked the same thing : )
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Feral Things
Junior Member
Posts โข 1,848
Likes โข 3,654
January 2012
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Hmp news
Aug 1, 2013 6:47:37 GMT 1
via mobile
Hmp news, by Feral Things on Aug 1, 2013 6:47:37 GMT 1, ...the world would be a very boring place if we all liked the same thing : ) Never was a truer word spoken!
Thanks to @amboguy and gravity1 for taking the time to respond. When an artist doesn't press my buttons it can be easy to just not bother to find out what they're about, so I appreciate the posts.
...the world would be a very boring place if we all liked the same thing : ) Never was a truer word spoken! Thanks to @amboguy and gravity1 for taking the time to respond. When an artist doesn't press my buttons it can be easy to just not bother to find out what they're about, so I appreciate the posts.
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graffuturism
New Member
Posts โข 754
Likes โข 771
March 2010
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Hmp news, by graffuturism on Aug 1, 2013 8:17:36 GMT 1, Seems hard to make a case for either side since it is "Art" and couldn't be any more subjective. I do believe that most creativity, no matter who it's from, is usually drawn to some degree from observing other creative efforts. I think it's tough being in the art mix and on this board and not in some way be affected by opinions, prices and disputes we see every day. But what I experience, as I'm sure many members do as well, is when I have people over the house who have little to zero art knowledge and exposure, especially urban art, and observing which pieces strike them and in what ways. Again this means nothing but it is interesting to me. I remember a month or so back commenting on a Hirst piece because I just couldn't believe that colored dots, made by an artist's assistant non the less, was going for so much scratch. Then owner of the piece acknowledged my points but said when people came over it was always the first piece they went to, which really opened my eyes to this point that no one could ever see though someone else's eyes or deprogram all the societal prejudices the art community instills in us all. We can never know what others see in a piece or their motivations in buying one. Seems almost as futile as a debate on which religion has more merit and comparing their motivations, inspirations and subscriber base. [/quote]
As I stated my critique didnt involve the buyer or collector that just apreciates the image or is drawn to a painting. I am not trying to belittle anyones reason for buying any painting. I wanted to draw attention to the bigger picture after you are starting to collect more beyond the image. I am sure your friends also ask you if it is a banksy as even if they know nothing or little about art I am sure you get that.
That is an interesting point you make about Hirst and its similar in more ways than one. It is debated that those dot paintings are actually copies of another artist as well Thomas Downing who painted a very similar series of paintings. Im not trying to debate the Hirst paintings just bring up the irony of your story and that artists will and have always been influenced by each other. Yet in Dolk's case I would say that the resemblance to another contemporary artist is alot closer than Hirsts was. Hirst copied or paid tribute as he calls it to paintings painted about 30 years prior. Dolk's work resembles a current contemporary artist in the same genre. Now we either look the other way and say its just an image that does no harm and that is enough to back someone, or we call a spade a spade and demand more from artists in our genre.
I do appreciate your response thats what this is all about dialogue not anyone being right or wrong.
Seems hard to make a case for either side since it is "Art" and couldn't be any more subjective. I do believe that most creativity, no matter who it's from, is usually drawn to some degree from observing other creative efforts. I think it's tough being in the art mix and on this board and not in some way be affected by opinions, prices and disputes we see every day. But what I experience, as I'm sure many members do as well, is when I have people over the house who have little to zero art knowledge and exposure, especially urban art, and observing which pieces strike them and in what ways. Again this means nothing but it is interesting to me. I remember a month or so back commenting on a Hirst piece because I just couldn't believe that colored dots, made by an artist's assistant non the less, was going for so much scratch. Then owner of the piece acknowledged my points but said when people came over it was always the first piece they went to, which really opened my eyes to this point that no one could ever see though someone else's eyes or deprogram all the societal prejudices the art community instills in us all. We can never know what others see in a piece or their motivations in buying one. Seems almost as futile as a debate on which religion has more merit and comparing their motivations, inspirations and subscriber base. [/quote] As I stated my critique didnt involve the buyer or collector that just apreciates the image or is drawn to a painting. I am not trying to belittle anyones reason for buying any painting. I wanted to draw attention to the bigger picture after you are starting to collect more beyond the image. I am sure your friends also ask you if it is a banksy as even if they know nothing or little about art I am sure you get that. That is an interesting point you make about Hirst and its similar in more ways than one. It is debated that those dot paintings are actually copies of another artist as well Thomas Downing who painted a very similar series of paintings. Im not trying to debate the Hirst paintings just bring up the irony of your story and that artists will and have always been influenced by each other. Yet in Dolk's case I would say that the resemblance to another contemporary artist is alot closer than Hirsts was. Hirst copied or paid tribute as he calls it to paintings painted about 30 years prior. Dolk's work resembles a current contemporary artist in the same genre. Now we either look the other way and say its just an image that does no harm and that is enough to back someone, or we call a spade a spade and demand more from artists in our genre. I do appreciate your response thats what this is all about dialogue not anyone being right or wrong.
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January 1970
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Hmp news, by Deleted on Aug 1, 2013 8:44:31 GMT 1,
Nope IMO most of his stuff is pretty boring. He is only similar to Banksy in that he copies Banksy's style a bit. But most of his stuff, prints especially are a bit of a bore to me. I know I'm in the minority here but I don't see what all the fuss is about. I think it is just people hyping him up because at a quick glance the work looks kinda Banksy like so it is an easy sale, people are hoping to make some quick cash. I have not figured out the fascination with this artist within this forum either. I search the internet daily for art and artists updates, I can say that I am pretty familiar with most artists and besides this forum I dont see this artist being talked about at all. When a new street piece is created, the image sweeps the globe and is, without a doubt, covered by any and all major blogs and sites dedicated to Street Art. Stencil Artists come from different culture to graff and it's not all about being "up" or bombing or the need to be constantly hitting the streets, because of the nature of their work, most tend to work out of their studio. Particularly if they've paid their dues are over 30 and have families. Also, stencil art tends to remain on the streets a LOT longer than graff, years and years in the cases of artists at Dolk's level. So the need to be constantly "up" is diminished.You would think that someone who has a very similar style as an original like banksy would get slack for resembling him so much, but its the opposite atleast in here. Banksy signed Dolk to pictures on walls in 2005, stencil art, by it's nature, can look "similar" in style to the uninitiated, but 99% of those involved in the culture can tell a Dolk from a Banksy from a Whatson from a Hicks etc etc. I'm sure to the uninitiated, that Graffiti pretty much all looks the same. Dolk's techniques, on canvas and the street, are very different to Banksy, and though the themes may seem similar, there's a much darker, more introverted and existential side to Dolk's work that's far less "political" or "propaganda like" than for example Banksy. To the uninitiated, all stencil's looks the same, all graffiti looks the same, all techno sounds the same.It shows the power and demand for banksy is so high that all one has to do is make a decent copy of his work and you as well can sell prints for more money than 90% of other well established street artists. It's not always about the money hey ? I'm presuming you're including "writers" in that 90% ? because most well established street artists are generally doing fine. It's a common gripe from writers and those businesses associated with graffiti culture that "why should these guys get paid when we've been here pounding the streets and paying dues since the 90's" which is insane considering that Graffiti is a global multi million dollar industry. If people are not getting paid, they need to look to their "supporters" rather than being down on fellow artists and Street Art. I would agree with most of these points made above and say that to each their own I am sure if you are buying for appreciation nothing matters other than what you think. To the others buying to flip or wondering if this artist will be in fact the next rising star I would say unlikely. This forum and London can drive one artists price up for so long until people realize that what we have here is a perfect example of being in the right place at the right time. Comparing this forum, or any print collectors forum with "art" is like comparing a watch collectors forum with "time". Collectors create their own markets, some of the artists will go on to cross over, build a long career and their fan base will grow, from Banksy to Barry McGee, this forum has championed them all. Others who over the long term, try to take advantage of our insecurities, values and minor bi polar disorders without giving back, will eventually suffer.I base my opinions on observations such as one he doesnt paint as much as you would like to see someone who is supposed to be the next big thing. Artists that continue to work in the street tend to more genuine and dedicated over the longrun. You can tell alot about an artist about how hard he works and that could also mean in the studio and streets. Dolk is not supposed to be the next big thing, most here have been following and supporting him for 10 years with zero expectations, this little price blip simply happened because he produced some street work that resonated and his fan base expanded driving up demand and hence prices. The "next big thing" is generally one of the non street artists on here with professional PR, Artist management and Gallery representation. It's rarely one of the little guys. Dolk paints every day.
To me dropping prints is an afterthought to an artist that is really accomplishing a real body of work. Second now that this artist is in this position with a style that everyone can see resembles banksy what is he doing to create his own genuine identity. Artists can evolve and those that do usually will show themselves to be more inclined for long term success IMO.Even if this new style distnaces himself from his collectors. One its not his style in the first place and two I would like to see what his hand or mark looks like. What does a Dolk look like? 3rd his market has been established in one country or area mostly and if you are paying as much as you are paying for his prints wouldnt you like to know that it wasnt a local phenonem. I dont see him getting any appreciation around the world. This is not a direct attack on Dolk as much as it is a direct comment on most the artists I see in this forum being collected for what In my opinion are wrong reasons. The one reason that doesnt matter is that you love the image or work, that I cannot argue against what one likes is what one likes. You can pick a secondary market Dolk print up for as little as $3-400, not an insane amount of cash i'm sure you'll agree. 1. His fan base is international. 2. It is his style, you just don't see it 3. His market was established in the UK with Banksy's help, recently expanded into his home country which has a solid and expanding economy hence the price hikes, Norwegians can and in a lot of cases, expect to pay far more than EU buyers. This will either grow, or settle down. 4. To collectors, of anything, like it or not, price, rarity, desirability etc etc, are very important attributes.You have to remember, this is first and foremost a "collectors" forum.
This is an attempt to show you some of the thinking that I take into looking at an artist when doing features or choosing to exhibit or buy. Its important to look past the superficial if you really want to guess where an artists might end up say in 5-10 years. This argument may have worked with Grafter, Eelus or a newcomer, but Dolk ? Just out of curiousity, who are you collecting that you think may "end up" somewhere in 5-10 years ? This board has championed quite a few artists that now appear regularly in contemporary art museums around the world.
Apologize to Dolk for using him as an example but figured it was fair game he is raking it in regardless not sure he would care. Again, this seems to be your prevailing criticism, that some artists are making a living, whilst in your eyes, some (abstract) artists are not ? Of course Dolk would care about criticism of his work, who wouldn't, artists are sensitive about s**t like that, that's why they're artists for the most. "Raking it in" isn't important to 99% of artists, no artist I know set out to make art to make money, as you know, they do it because it's in them, and they had the balls to take an alternative route to happiness than a 9 to 5.
Nope IMO most of his stuff is pretty boring. He is only similar to Banksy in that he copies Banksy's style a bit. But most of his stuff, prints especially are a bit of a bore to me. I know I'm in the minority here but I don't see what all the fuss is about. I think it is just people hyping him up because at a quick glance the work looks kinda Banksy like so it is an easy sale, people are hoping to make some quick cash. I have not figured out the fascination with this artist within this forum either. I search the internet daily for art and artists updates, I can say that I am pretty familiar with most artists and besides this forum I dont see this artist being talked about at all. When a new street piece is created, the image sweeps the globe and is, without a doubt, covered by any and all major blogs and sites dedicated to Street Art. Stencil Artists come from different culture to graff and it's not all about being "up" or bombing or the need to be constantly hitting the streets, because of the nature of their work, most tend to work out of their studio. Particularly if they've paid their dues are over 30 and have families. Also, stencil art tends to remain on the streets a LOT longer than graff, years and years in the cases of artists at Dolk's level. So the need to be constantly "up" is diminished.You would think that someone who has a very similar style as an original like banksy would get slack for resembling him so much, but its the opposite atleast in here. Banksy signed Dolk to pictures on walls in 2005, stencil art, by it's nature, can look "similar" in style to the uninitiated, but 99% of those involved in the culture can tell a Dolk from a Banksy from a Whatson from a Hicks etc etc. I'm sure to the uninitiated, that Graffiti pretty much all looks the same. Dolk's techniques, on canvas and the street, are very different to Banksy, and though the themes may seem similar, there's a much darker, more introverted and existential side to Dolk's work that's far less "political" or "propaganda like" than for example Banksy. To the uninitiated, all stencil's looks the same, all graffiti looks the same, all techno sounds the same.It shows the power and demand for banksy is so high that all one has to do is make a decent copy of his work and you as well can sell prints for more money than 90% of other well established street artists. It's not always about the money hey ? I'm presuming you're including "writers" in that 90% ? because most well established street artists are generally doing fine. It's a common gripe from writers and those businesses associated with graffiti culture that "why should these guys get paid when we've been here pounding the streets and paying dues since the 90's" which is insane considering that Graffiti is a global multi million dollar industry. If people are not getting paid, they need to look to their "supporters" rather than being down on fellow artists and Street Art. I would agree with most of these points made above and say that to each their own I am sure if you are buying for appreciation nothing matters other than what you think. To the others buying to flip or wondering if this artist will be in fact the next rising star I would say unlikely. This forum and London can drive one artists price up for so long until people realize that what we have here is a perfect example of being in the right place at the right time. Comparing this forum, or any print collectors forum with "art" is like comparing a watch collectors forum with "time". Collectors create their own markets, some of the artists will go on to cross over, build a long career and their fan base will grow, from Banksy to Barry McGee, this forum has championed them all. Others who over the long term, try to take advantage of our insecurities, values and minor bi polar disorders without giving back, will eventually suffer.I base my opinions on observations such as one he doesnt paint as much as you would like to see someone who is supposed to be the next big thing. Artists that continue to work in the street tend to more genuine and dedicated over the longrun. You can tell alot about an artist about how hard he works and that could also mean in the studio and streets. Dolk is not supposed to be the next big thing, most here have been following and supporting him for 10 years with zero expectations, this little price blip simply happened because he produced some street work that resonated and his fan base expanded driving up demand and hence prices. The "next big thing" is generally one of the non street artists on here with professional PR, Artist management and Gallery representation. It's rarely one of the little guys. Dolk paints every day.
To me dropping prints is an afterthought to an artist that is really accomplishing a real body of work. Second now that this artist is in this position with a style that everyone can see resembles banksy what is he doing to create his own genuine identity. Artists can evolve and those that do usually will show themselves to be more inclined for long term success IMO.Even if this new style distnaces himself from his collectors. One its not his style in the first place and two I would like to see what his hand or mark looks like. What does a Dolk look like? 3rd his market has been established in one country or area mostly and if you are paying as much as you are paying for his prints wouldnt you like to know that it wasnt a local phenonem. I dont see him getting any appreciation around the world. This is not a direct attack on Dolk as much as it is a direct comment on most the artists I see in this forum being collected for what In my opinion are wrong reasons. The one reason that doesnt matter is that you love the image or work, that I cannot argue against what one likes is what one likes. You can pick a secondary market Dolk print up for as little as $3-400, not an insane amount of cash i'm sure you'll agree. 1. His fan base is international. 2. It is his style, you just don't see it 3. His market was established in the UK with Banksy's help, recently expanded into his home country which has a solid and expanding economy hence the price hikes, Norwegians can and in a lot of cases, expect to pay far more than EU buyers. This will either grow, or settle down. 4. To collectors, of anything, like it or not, price, rarity, desirability etc etc, are very important attributes.You have to remember, this is first and foremost a "collectors" forum.
This is an attempt to show you some of the thinking that I take into looking at an artist when doing features or choosing to exhibit or buy. Its important to look past the superficial if you really want to guess where an artists might end up say in 5-10 years. This argument may have worked with Grafter, Eelus or a newcomer, but Dolk ? Just out of curiousity, who are you collecting that you think may "end up" somewhere in 5-10 years ? This board has championed quite a few artists that now appear regularly in contemporary art museums around the world.
Apologize to Dolk for using him as an example but figured it was fair game he is raking it in regardless not sure he would care. Again, this seems to be your prevailing criticism, that some artists are making a living, whilst in your eyes, some (abstract) artists are not ? Of course Dolk would care about criticism of his work, who wouldn't, artists are sensitive about s**t like that, that's why they're artists for the most. "Raking it in" isn't important to 99% of artists, no artist I know set out to make art to make money, as you know, they do it because it's in them, and they had the balls to take an alternative route to happiness than a 9 to 5.
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graffuturism
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March 2010
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Hmp news, by graffuturism on Aug 1, 2013 8:51:02 GMT 1, That's a fair point; everyone likes different things and looks for different things in art and your post is much more constructive than the usual 'Well Banksy is great and Dolk is sh*t' argument you hear from some people! I don't like the nonrepresentational art you were talking about in a recent thread. Now please please understand that this isn't just a silly tit for tat argument I'm trying to start here, far from it, I'm just saying that I don't understand what I'm looking at but you yourself can clearly see something in it - which is great - but it's just not for me at all. Even respected artists like Mr Jago do nothing for me because I need to see 'something' when I look at art. Whether its obvious what that something is doing in the print or what that aomething is trying to say is a different matter and is open to interpretation but i just need to see an object that i can clearly identify. It's said that Dolk does give a meaning to his prints but keeps it to himself, I'm fine with that as I give them my own meanings. Do I like all of his prints? no, but I do like most of them. I enjoy looking at them which, despite what some art snobs say, is really the main reason for buying an artists work. I'm glad we have all types and styles of art, even artists I just don't 'get', as I was always told when I was young that the world would be a very boring place if we all liked the same thing : ) No worries mate believe me I have very thick skin and I am sure I can handle anything thrown my way and I dont take it personal. I actually appreciate the response as I know its tough for people to talk about something that they might just be getting into or have been into for awhile. As a person that involves most everything I do with art, art collectors like yourself are very important. I respect anyone that puts money towards something like a piece of art. So I am not trying to fight or get into an argument either. I just want to bring another side to the story although a more negative one maybe in this case. As far as the non-representational I understand that completely and it is not for everyone. But some would say that it is the non-representational that moves them in a way that cant be stated or illustrated. I love both forms yet choose to mainly focus on the non-representational artists because I have always felt they were misrepresented and I took a stance to feature them more. But when I feature any artist I take the same criteria as mentioned in my first post. This is something that made me question the work of Dolk and his popularity as well as others on the forum recently. And for the Record I am with you, we should always be allowed to like what we like without a need for explanation.
That's a fair point; everyone likes different things and looks for different things in art and your post is much more constructive than the usual 'Well Banksy is great and Dolk is sh*t' argument you hear from some people! I don't like the nonrepresentational art you were talking about in a recent thread. Now please please understand that this isn't just a silly tit for tat argument I'm trying to start here, far from it, I'm just saying that I don't understand what I'm looking at but you yourself can clearly see something in it - which is great - but it's just not for me at all. Even respected artists like Mr Jago do nothing for me because I need to see 'something' when I look at art. Whether its obvious what that something is doing in the print or what that aomething is trying to say is a different matter and is open to interpretation but i just need to see an object that i can clearly identify. It's said that Dolk does give a meaning to his prints but keeps it to himself, I'm fine with that as I give them my own meanings. Do I like all of his prints? no, but I do like most of them. I enjoy looking at them which, despite what some art snobs say, is really the main reason for buying an artists work. I'm glad we have all types and styles of art, even artists I just don't 'get', as I was always told when I was young that the world would be a very boring place if we all liked the same thing : ) No worries mate believe me I have very thick skin and I am sure I can handle anything thrown my way and I dont take it personal. I actually appreciate the response as I know its tough for people to talk about something that they might just be getting into or have been into for awhile. As a person that involves most everything I do with art, art collectors like yourself are very important. I respect anyone that puts money towards something like a piece of art. So I am not trying to fight or get into an argument either. I just want to bring another side to the story although a more negative one maybe in this case. As far as the non-representational I understand that completely and it is not for everyone. But some would say that it is the non-representational that moves them in a way that cant be stated or illustrated. I love both forms yet choose to mainly focus on the non-representational artists because I have always felt they were misrepresented and I took a stance to feature them more. But when I feature any artist I take the same criteria as mentioned in my first post. This is something that made me question the work of Dolk and his popularity as well as others on the forum recently. And for the Record I am with you, we should always be allowed to like what we like without a need for explanation.
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Deleted
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Hmp news
Aug 1, 2013 8:58:06 GMT 1
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Hmp news, by Deleted on Aug 1, 2013 8:58:06 GMT 1, Hey I only said hmp are working on a new print !!!
Hey I only said hmp are working on a new print !!!
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Deleted
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January 1970
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Hmp news, by Deleted on Aug 1, 2013 9:03:15 GMT 1, Hey I only said hmp are working on a new print !!! lol
Hey I only said hmp are working on a new print !!! lol
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Hmp news, by fingerz on Aug 1, 2013 9:29:56 GMT 1, Hey I only said hmp are working on a new print !!! how very very dare you .....
Hey I only said hmp are working on a new print !!! how very very dare you .....
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